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A. Hitler out for a duck, leg before wicket, caught at silly mid-on off a chinaman googlyHaven’t seen the Cap’n around for a day or two but he came immediately to mind on seeing this piece in the Times recounting Der Chef’s telling brush with the sport of cricket. It seems he was not impressed - regarding it as unmanly and un-German - and called for the rules to be changed to abolish the use of protective pads and substituting a bigger and harder ball. (Harder! Anyone who’s taken a fast ball in an unpadded area will know it’s plenty hard enough, except perhaps for an Aryan Supermensch).
Couldn’t resist that last naughty little bit, could they.
Posted by Dan Dare on Friday, March 19, 2010 at 08:28 PM in Comments:2
Posted by calvin on March 19, 2010, 10:40 PM | # Yes, I’ve heard about this. This was around about the time that he challenged a Black American musician to a saxophone battle. Hitler’s rigid Teutonic mentality was unable to compete with the Negro’s slick, intuitive, improvisations, and Hitler went off in a huff, declaring that jazz was a “decadent” musical form and that only German’s could make great music, and Wagner was the only great musician. Hitler’s gloom was compounded when he later lost a cook off to a team of French chefs whose flambes and ragouts made the future fuhrers bratwurst und cabbage look bland and pedestrian. We don’t even want to talk about the break dancing! What a load of old pish! If you believe this tripe you’d believe in soap, lampshades and geysers of race specific blood. 3
Posted by Lurker on March 19, 2010, 11:29 PM | # I can believe that Hitler and others may have played cricket against POWs but I’m not sure I can buy into the whole rewritting the rules story. 4
Posted by Yawn on March 20, 2010, 09:02 AM | # Another Hitler story, brought to you by the people who brought you modern Britain. Keep it up, fanboys. Your crappy little island’s in good shape, ain’t it? 5
Posted by Gorboduc on March 20, 2010, 09:12 AM | # Was this story actually supposed to be released on April 1? I remember encountering a theory that Hitler had visited Liverpool; I once worked in a press-cutting office, and remember that between 1966 and 1968 there were several ludicrous “those stupid Nazis” stories printed. 6
Posted by Dan Dare on March 20, 2010, 03:23 PM | # Indeed Gorbo, the cartographic skills of the Nazis do seem to have left something to be desired. Recent reports of newly uncovered invasion plans indicate that Hitler intended to make Bridgnorth in Shropshire his post-invasion HQ, owing in part to the presence of an existing airbase nearby. It is the case that RAF Bridgnorth was located a couple of miles from the town, but the fact that it didn’t actually have any runways appears to have escaped attention. Taking the mickey out of Jerry is of course a time-honoured tradition, one made doubly pleasurable by his almost total lack of defences, the standard response being impotent rage, as we have seen here too. 7
Posted by Andrew on March 20, 2010, 04:37 PM | # I would have been a funny sight though; Hitler being L B W on his first ball – then given out by the umpire; you have to admit, that was a very strong and incorruptible decision to give Hitler the finger: hhahahahah 8
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 20, 2010, 08:13 PM | # “Taking the mickey out of Jerry is of course a time-honoured tradition, one made doubly pleasurable by his almost total lack of defences, the standard response being impotent rage, as we have seen here too.” (—DD) You don’t by any chance see a link between your “taking the mickey out of Jerry” 1939-45 on the one hand, and on the other your country’s forced race-replacement régime of today, do you Dan? Somehow I wonder if you truly get what’s going on. Sort of like JamesUK — he doesn’t get what’s going on, seems to think it’s still 1955. Do you, Dan? Get what’s going on, I mean. With respect, I don’t get the point of the log entry. It’s more something one would expect to see at Harry’s Place. The world has moved on since 1955, Dan. New light is being shone on certain issues people in 1955 thought they understood, thought they had all figured out but turns out they really didn’t. Turns out they didn’t have a clue. Genocide’s afoot, Dan. Ours. You haven’t heard? 9
Posted by PF on March 20, 2010, 10:19 PM | #
Your assertion, and the latent assertion of many Americans of Germanocentric leaning: There is a kind of cosmic karma which the universe is inflicting on Britain for resisting the Nazis. My rebuttal: Cosmic karma is something I dont believe in. The conflict in WWII has more dimensions than is being recognized when this assertion is made, especially as it was not primarily a conflict about racial self defense but about intra-European fratricidal war, which is an aspect of NSDAP platform neglected in this retrospective view. The people who assert this are not friends or lovers of England, they do it out of Schadenfreude and self-commiseration. Retrospective what-if scenarios are generally considered intellectual masturbation, where they are not useful as thought experiments. These what-if scenarios can’t even be realistically carried out by those who are emotionally attached to the vindication of Hitler, because they have accepted the view of Hitler as the embodiment of white racial defense, which he was not. Merely one exponent of it, with enough cultural baggage to invalidate his claim to this, if the person doing the thinking had the breadth of perspective to allow him choice. This reasoning, being used to retrospectively blame and lambast the English, denying them the right to resist foreign invasion if that invader simply advocates white interests, is inherently anti-English. Any group has the right to defend themselves against aggression from without. Lastly, as far as the extreme sensitivity lavished on Hitler: being an advocate of racial nationalism does not free you from the demand to operate in strategically sound manner with other whites. Finally, racial nationalists are men too, and when they make a stand and go to war against another nation they are taking the same chance as any other man, irrespective of ideology. If they play this game, and they lose, then they die. All their beautiful beliefs aside, and the retrospective love for these beliefs that wishes their rebirth in places like Chicago and Michigan, those men who make a stand against another nation and lose are subject to the full force of laws of human nature which go exactly as deep as the laws of racial loyalty. No one who loves truth should chide history as if it were unfair, moaning over it like a sour girl on a playground, as if feigning to want to spare Hitler the harshness of English malice. That was another man’s score to settle, something those far removed from it scarcely have a right to comment on. 10
Posted by PF on March 20, 2010, 10:21 PM | # LOL…. lastly… finally… man I was in a frenzy of concluding right there, wasnt I? 11
Posted by Grimoire on March 20, 2010, 10:21 PM | # the article is unworthy, and stupid. It reinforces a idea that some need to to stoop to unmatched depths to bolster bruised pride, which makes them look pathetic in their impotence. Your attempt to pick up your spirits by this, really only insults the British, and badly. I think this is undeserved You are mistaken about this tim -honoured tradition…the traditional German response to this type of stupidity is to wonder at what point will you reach the depth that you will not sink beyond. 12
Posted by Captainchaos on March 21, 2010, 02:56 AM | #
You seem to be saying the Nazis viewed fratricidal war as an end unto itself. That is absurd. Of course there was an aspect of achieving for Germany a place amongst the nations on the global stage a place commensurate with its merits, but the larger vision was that of the creation of a new order under German leadership which was intended to prevent the slide of our race into oblivion. And if successful it would have achieved just that.
Churchill himself never believed there was a realistic possibility of German invasion, which there was not, which is why he build up British forces in North Africa. Churchill cynically used the prospect of invasion, the logic of the primordial will to self-defense, to keep the fight going to smash Germany.
Then I suspect you will from here on refrain from pronouncements of the ‘unfairness’ of the diminution into nothingness of the English due to mongrelization. If they can be guilted into not raising a hand against it, then they do not deserve to survive, by your own reasoning. 14
Posted by PF on March 21, 2010, 04:30 AM | # CC,
Men are judged by their actions. Their actions resulted in fratricidal warfare. Only your what-ifs and rationalizations shield them from indictment, and they are based in fantasy.
A place commensurate with its merits? You are rewording this nicely.
Did your crystal ball say that? Or your mental model of how European politics worked 1939-1945? Or your mental model of what was politically possible, feasible and necessary in Europe in the 40s and 50s? On what data are these conclusions based? i.e. what books did you read?
You see what clues me in to the one-sidedness of your truth search is the fact that in the case of your putative antagonist, you wield a psychological scalpel. In the case of our hero Adolf, I’ve seen you write things about him which for any true student of the subtleties of human nature were embarrassing to read even in text. Why does one man get the analysis, the other a boot-licking?
Fairness exists within the family circle, and even there it doesnt really exist except by common agreement. It is an idea or a mental algorithm which makes resource sharing easier within the circle of relatedness. You cannot start a war and then invoke it, or invoke it with a foreign nation that is hostile to you. At any rate your entrapment doesn’t work because I never believed in fair treatment from any of our dispossessors, if we win things it will clearly be by the brunt of our own hands. Look at the facts, your Nazism alienates you from your fellow Americans, from the Germans, and from your philosophical friends here. It drives a wedge even between people with whom you would otherwise be 95% aligned with in spirit. How are you going to work with anyone to achieve anything? You’ve said enough against the English at this point that I almost cannot bear you anymore and begin to think of you as an enemy, because in truth even the wogs I know are not so anti-English as you are. Anyway, good luck with your muave map of germanic Michigan based on old census data, I guess one reason why you bash my heritage so badly and cling to this stuff is because you dont really belong to any heritage or tradition and don’t understand what this means. If you had the privilege of belonging to a tradition that was deeper than ideas - even your love of Hitler is a love of ideas, something you will ultimately grow out of and recant - if you had that deeper love then you would respect it in others, you would know why the English had to resist Hitler. You would never ask them to do otherwise. But for you, European conflicts are conflicts of competing sets of ideas. Some peoples loyalties run deeper than ideas and their consequences. Some of the ideational consequences of the British stance in that battle were very negative, and have led to our present troubles - thats the whole truth of your shtick. But everyone on here recognizes that, and yet we cant renounce our grandfathers because of the theoretical outcomes of political policies instituted by the governments they fought under. You apparently can do this, and will attribute to a whole group of people the fault of supporting a government whose policy was ultimately flawed or short-sighted, while championing another group about which you know nothing or have no real experience (The Germans), because you believe in their ideas. Your “loyalty” in this vein is purely imaginary. Remember how you gave that terribly, horribly awkward pretend military salute to Grimoire in the comments section of another thread? And then, the very next day, called him a bitch and basically threatened to beat him up? You love ideas like the liberal kids I went to school with love their mental sympathy-candy, because you are rootless. You have the perfect racial utopia vision in your head and thats all you care about, not flesh and blood white people. 15
Posted by Wandrin on March 21, 2010, 07:57 AM | #
It’s sort of indirectly true. Fear of the Nazis chased huge numbers of jews out of central and Western Europe leading them to come and infect the Anglosphere en masse and seventy years later the Anglosphere is on the brink of economic and social collapse. However despite that… The Germans should have the same right in my view. 16
Posted by Captainchaos on March 21, 2010, 11:24 AM | #
Indeed, the American and British people followed their leaders, hopped up on the rhetoric of meeting out justice according to liberal standards, and now they have internalized those standards consistent with that moral crusade they engaged in erected as the founding mythos of the new order it ushered in. They are being judged by those standards. And from here until the final dissolution of their people, their enemies will make reference to that founding mythos to shame them to their deaths. Resistance, too strenuous of a resistance, is evil, and if they cannot resist their genocide without maximum muscularity, then it is their moral duty to perish. That is why the mythos must be faced, and to a degree reclaimed without shame, unless one is willing to accept the alternative.
Germans, from the highest to the lowest levels, said just that, that they were fighting for a new order in Europe. Even recently a guest on The Heretics’ Hour on Voice of Reason, Dr. Wilhelm Kriessmann, who was in the Luftwaffe, said they fought for Europe and against Communism.
What one fought for would have resulted in the salvation of the race, what the other fought for may well yet result in its annihilation. Men and peoples are judged by their actions, isn’t that what you said?
You won’t find any traction in the zeitgeist to leverage the minds and hearts of the mass of our people to our side with that kind of thinking. Europeans seem compelled to think in terms of ‘fairness’ on a large and abstract scale. I wish I could make the pitch to them of naked collective self-interest, but it probably wouldn’t amount to much, at least at this time. Nor will your tact prove sufficient, as pursuing their interests in isolation of their larger group interests, without reference to the larger picture, is pretty well what they already do.
Current census prediction indicate Michigan will be one of the very last states to go non-White majority after the turn of the century, I think I’ll stay put.
You are not even fully English are you, didn’t you say your mother is from Minnesota, just what are the various components of your ancestry? 17
Posted by Gudmund on March 21, 2010, 12:00 PM | #
I agree, and you’ll notice that the Brythons are usually the ones initiating the hostility in these threads. PF and Dan Dare. Beating a Kraut horse which died more than a half-century ago, and for what? A Dutchman once told me that the English could never be considered pro-white and these days I’m beginning to wonder if he wasn’t correct.
Ah-ha, the old pot-kettle-black, eh? I suppose we are just to ignore all of the Brythons’ (and their allies’) blatant provocations. NN did a fine job of listing all of those a few weeks back so you can revisit them if you feel the need:
To which your only defense was calling it “an easter egg hunt for supporting evidence.” Very slick. When the evidence doesn’t agree with your decidedly partisan view, all of a sudden it is suspect. 18
Posted by aug (not "uh" ok) on March 21, 2010, 12:40 PM | # Look at the facts, your Nazism alienates you from your fellow Americans, from the Germans, and from your philosophical friends here. What alienates him is the bullish follower’s mentality. His allegiance is to fantasy and his own bad attitude: you’ll never succeed in getting past that. A Dutchman once told me that the English could never be considered pro-white and these days I’m beginning to wonder if he wasn’t correct. The English are fratricidally obnoxious, at least. 19
Posted by Dan Dare on March 21, 2010, 01:24 PM | #
Where’s the harm in a little gentle leg-pulling especially when the target is so inviting? We can’t all be moping all day long about genocide and race-replacement, can we. I mean where’s the fun in that? You too can win a pig’s head, go for it. 20
Posted by Dan Dare on March 21, 2010, 02:22 PM | #
Old Grimbo is quite obviously an aficianado of the von Brickendrop school of international diplomacy - pack in the piss-taking or else we’ll invade! 21
Posted by gmander on March 21, 2010, 03:22 PM | #
More twitters, snorts, snickers, and condescension from MR’s leather armchair, Wedgwood China set. Gonna do something about it, GW? Or is irrelevance the goal? 22
Posted by franklin on March 21, 2010, 03:25 PM | # “There is a kind of cosmic karma which the universe is inflicting on Britain for resisting the Nazis. My rebuttal: Cosmic karma is something I dont believe in.” LOL. Eternal student, and fitting GW acolyte, sets up a strawman, then, amazingly, burns it. “The conflict in WWII has more dimensions than is being recognized when this assertion is made…” Then learn to parse, pallie. It’s what we do in science. Get rid of your post-Jebu mindset, put down your borrowed copy of Gurdjieff, and take a walk through a field or, in your thoroughly Anglicized industrial landscape, watch a video. Life. Death. That’s all there is. It doesn’t matter if the latter comes about through predation, lack of fecundity, destruction of soil, pollution, or what have you. You die or you live. And when you’re alive, you’re either predator or prey, free or enslaved. “The people who assert this are not friends or lovers of England…” I’ve asked your bizarre mentor before - what is “England”? An island? The Hindoos who populate it? The Rothschilds? The Jamaicans? The Anglo-Saxons who facilitate them in their various pursuits? Those who rail against immigrantion? Drunken yobs and shameless whores? Were the thousands of fascists locked up by far-seeing Churchill and his cronies English? Are you more “English” than David Irving? Is he more English than some pasty dingbat screaming about racism? If I cheer old Oswald am I a friend of England? When GW bashes every modern extant English political figure, is he a friend of England? Have you ever once, PW, read a book about WWII that didn’t include adjectives fit for three year olds? Seriously, do you ever even make the attempt to grasp cause and effect in warfare and life? “Men are judged by their actions. Their actions resulted in fratricidal warfare.” Ugh. Grow up, philosopher. You’d be perfect on a Kwa jury - “Well, he deserved to get beat up for walking through that neighborhood.” I can equally, and more aptly, say that Churchill’s actions resulted in fratricidal warfare, as the German government at the time was constantly pointing out. “...you would know why the English had to resist Hitler.” There it is again, “the English”. Millions of people of exactly the same mores and belief systems, “resisting” a single man. And this, to you, passes as “history”. Man, thank the gods you guys no longer procreate. 23
Posted by Dan Dare on March 21, 2010, 04:15 PM | #
And here’s another one. Gerrymander minor, tormented beyond endurance by the bigger lads poking fun at his funny accent and half-baked ‘Weltanschauung’, runs off to tell teacher, bawling his eyes out. You fucking faux Krauts are pathetic beyond words. 24
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 21, 2010, 04:18 PM | # ”We can’t all be moping all day long about genocide and race-replacement, can we.” (—DD) Well no, surely not when, as is the case with you, those are viewed as minor or non-existent issues. By all means continue to concern yourself with today’s most pressing issue, namely chortling over the losers of World War II, all the more so as your participation in that war set your people on the road it now treads to a more vibrant future. That’s something to chortle about. Pay no attentuion whatsoever to the other chortling you hear, Britain’s mystery meat chortling over their soon-to-be-established ascendancy over whites in the British Isles — can’t all be moping all day long! You’re Gongstar/Nux-Gnomica, right? 25
Posted by Guessedworker on March 21, 2010, 04:28 PM | # gmander, Americans, especially German-Americans, would do well to note that the Old Continent is alive with mutual piss-taking. The English, the Irish and the Scots have been at it for the last thousand years or two. The English and the French, and the Russians and Poles are no different. Germans, it is true, can appear somewhat challenged in the humour department, but that doesn’t save them from the pitiless attentions of the French, Dutch, Poles, Danes and English. It’s how we are. We like it. We are not going to change. And it is not divisive - it is part of what unites us as equals and men of good heart. 26
Posted by Guest Lurker on March 21, 2010, 04:41 PM | #
Maybe I’ve entered this thread late and have missed something, but who egged on the Poles to behave stubbornly against the Germans about Danzig, who first declared war on who during WW2, who rebuffed whose overtures for peace after the war was underway, and who spared whose army at Dunkirk? There is something cretinous about the way Anglos, the jews’ traditional golems, view the world, and especially the Germanophobia with which they are apparently weened from their mother’s milk. Anglo messianism and hypocrisy, especially with regard to the Germans, is almost jew-like. The English will never forgive the Germans for not acquiescing to their military and economic hegemony. It’s simple spite. 27
Posted by Dan Dare on March 21, 2010, 04:52 PM | # Oh Gawd here we go again. We’ve done all that ad nauseum so piss off back to Hooterville Kentucky or wherever else it is you hail from! Faux Krauts, cartoon Nazis and Third Reich Nostalgics who gormlessly cling to fantasies surrounding a long-dead and totally discredited ideology are not simply despicable, they are risible. Their maunderings have precisely zero relevance to contemporary Europe, about which they are almost embarrassingly ignorant. Few if any of them will have ever spent any amount in any German-speaking country, and their knowledge of German history except for that of a very particular 12-year period is non-existent, as is their exposure to contemporary German culture, society or politics. The greatest irony is that is the very people whose interests they claim to espouse, their co-called deutsche Volksgenossen, who hold them in the greatest contempt of all. 28
Posted by Captainchaos on March 21, 2010, 05:09 PM | #
This sounds like the way anti-racists characterize racism.
That is the brainwashing talking, and you wholeheartedly approve, correct? 30
Posted by Grimoire on March 21, 2010, 05:22 PM | # @DD & GW: 31
Posted by Captainchaos on March 21, 2010, 05:30 PM | # Joke about Krauts all you want, I really don’t give a shit. It’s the shaming into submission associated with the Holohoax and Nazism for ALL Whites that is the crux of the issue for me. They will never stop beating us with that stick, NEVER. Until we tell them to go fuck themselves in no uncertain terms. 32
Posted by Dan Dare on March 21, 2010, 05:36 PM | # Grimbo - you are displaying exactly the sort of po-faced over-earnestness that causes the hilarity in the first place! Are you familiar with the Parable of the Beach Towels? Or the Sagas of the Penalty Shootouts? Every Briton knows and enjoys them no matter their social class or economic status. The English in particular have a curiously oblique approach to many things - war and humour in particular - which other, more linear-thinking cultures do not understand and often find silly, pointless or even a little sinister. We touched on this phenomenon in the other thread here 33
Posted by Guest Lurker on March 21, 2010, 05:46 PM | #
I love you too, you spiteful Anglo priss. 34
Posted by Grimoire on March 21, 2010, 06:08 PM | # @Dan Dare: 35
Posted by Al Ross on March 21, 2010, 06:32 PM | # England at its best : http://anthem4england.co.uk/modules/news/article.php?storyid=19 36
Posted by Guessedworker on March 21, 2010, 06:40 PM | # Brother Grim: I also hope it can be contained, and you have a complete recovery. You see, it’s contagious. 37
Posted by PF on March 21, 2010, 09:35 PM | # Gudmund,
Its true that I turned that man away with a phrase, instead of a counterargument. Which is normally bad form. Let me put our real difficulty in front of you by wording it this way: do you really think we can undertake an exhaustive investigation of cause-effect-responsibility-motivation, of the actors in the WWII, here on this board? The enormity of that project, is really beyond the scope of any blog. Some of NN’s points were surely valid. I trust that any man who undertakes this endeavor will quickly come to the conclusion that (1) the western media story is clearly exaggerated on all sorts of counts (2) but not fundamentally entirely wrong. More than that, is really difficult to decipher. I dislike the slow rise of the baseline of polemic words because it causes a vicious cycle, but I have to use the word “naive” to characterize a historical analysis that thinks it can neatly proportion out right and wrong. That is the latent assumption in the ‘historification’ I see among internet historians. Since you’ve proven you read the blog and have memory, being a learning system with hysteresis, perhaps you believe the series of posts I made some time ago about the biography of Joachim Fest. Did you see the harsh terms in which that author was condemned out of hand? Do you see the connection between what was said in those condemnations and how the study of history being undertaken by these Faux Krauts (thanks DD) is being conducted? On so, so many occasions here we’ve seen the deliberate bias, a gross embrace of everything pro-Hitler that would put real modern Germans to shame, since they believe they have learned from that conflict… Anyway, thanks for paying attention!
The issue is this: that dead horse is constantly present. Since talking about it is synonymous with “beating it”, we are bound to beat the dead horse. But who dug up the dead horse and keeps bringing him back in our house? I dont give a fuck about any of this old stuff. Captain Chaos is a National Socialist. On whose account, mine or his, do you imagine we are often discussing this issue? If you remember back to all the long ongoing thread battles in 2007 and 2008, it was the constant background presence of an element of the commentariat that believed (1) Hitler was our only hope / a valid champion of us (2) the Brits had thwarted white interests permanently by defeating him (3) we had to constantly keep this in mind (4) responsibility could not be allocated to the Germans because of their right thinking, or because of some bulleted 10-point list a la NeoNietzsche. Those discussions went on forever. Yet who felt the need to bring up NS so often? Most likely the people that thought NS still has residual value!! In this thread it is also Fred Scrooby demonstrating he also still has love for Hitler’s ghost, which caused me to speak on the issue. Guest Lurker wrote:
My thesis isn’t that the Brits were free of any motivation to war or anything of that sort. But the ultimate decision to go to war on each of the countries that Germany went to war with, lay in Germany’s hands. If you are willing to put yourself into someone elses shoes, of course their point of view will make sense to you. The faux Krauts are willing to do this with the Germans, but not the English. Thats why the Germans end up looking like wronged little saviors, even in spite of Hitler making no end of speeches which state quite nakedly their pretty nasty intent. Apparently these people who are writing have not read Hitler’s speeches. The whole war is prefigured in the Worldview described in those speeches. Thats why I say that that war followed from that worldview, and not from any chance circumstances with the Poles over Danzig which forced an innnocent Germany to go to war. Franklin wrote:
The contention here is that the men whose arguments I was addressing were mischaracterized, that I had made a strawman. I consider the constant reemphasis of the British role in the defeat of the Nazis to presume some kind of belief in karma. Why else would they still be talking about something that long gone? In the hopes that we can recognize we were wrong to oppose Hitler and see the truth? That is the other option, perhaps you’re right, it may be more realistic than the karma hypothesis. I wrote:
First off, don’t lecture me about science - it would take a fair bit of remedial education for most of the men involved in this debate to be able to participate in a scientific examination of the subjects they are discussing. Your presumption that its possible to parse the factors contributing to cause and effect and motivation structures in huge conflicts between nations is problematic. Have you tried to do it? Holy fuck its difficult! These people who imagine right and wrong can be sussed out by reading some articles or even a few books… I think they have a lot to learn both about their own lives and the world in general. Is right or wrong ever clear in our own lives? Occasionally. But add more people, and more people, and people divided by vast cultural accumulations, and it gets very difficult. As for what else you’ve said, its weakness is manifest, so I’ve no need to comment.
If you love your English family members who fought in this conflict, you probably wont come on the internet making blanket statements about Anglos and how they caused our racial downfall by opposing Hitler. If you dont know what England is, and dont know who is English, then perhaps this is a territory in the world of thought where you should tread lightly.
Do I ever make the attempt to grasp cause and effect….
What you’ve hit upon, in your one-sided and polemical way, is one of the main difficulties in understanding history: building mental models of the actions-motivations-possibilities-aims of tens, hundreds, thousands and millions of people. Its one of the reasons why I refuse the conclusions of the pro-Hitler historical analysis, that and the gross ignorance of the basic facts which I continue to encounter in these internet researchers. Do you want me to give an example of that, so we will know its more than words? NeoNietzsche above gave a 10 point memo which is supposed to point to the British role in instigating WWII. Its full of all kinds of little tidbits which had to crabbed from near and far: but fair enough - some of it will no doubt be true. Yet he has apparently never read the compiled speeches of Hitler with a critical eye. Ask yourself: how can that be? Well, welcome to the world of closet internet geniuses, they mine history to find in it what they will. History is so rich, permits so many perspectives, that it is glad to oblige them.
so confused white mongrels like yourself are going to inherit the earth, is that what you’re sayin’? See its fine to be a confused white mongrel, but keep your nose out of other nations’ business, or be helpful. Don’t pretend to have cracked the code to understanding European history when you never even set foot in the countries you talk about and English, German, is all just words and dreams to you. 38
Posted by PF on March 21, 2010, 10:22 PM | # CC wrote:
Its true that I’m half-English merely. Westfalian Kraut and Anglo-Scotsirish make up the difference. Have you ever been to Europe? 39
Posted by gmander on March 21, 2010, 10:44 PM | #
Ever been to Australia or New Zealand? Alaska? Iceland? South Africa? Japan? South Korea? Taiwan?
I’m of English, Scot, and Irish ancestry, actually. 40
Posted by Guest Lurker on March 21, 2010, 10:47 PM | #
Will you provide us with an example or a link of these speeches made prior to the outbreak of the war so we know what you’re talking about then? Thanks. 41
Posted by garth on March 21, 2010, 11:03 PM | # “Don’t pretend to have cracked the code to understanding European history when you never even set foot in the countries you talk about and English, German, is all just words and dreams to you.” There you go again, little man, making weird statements about someone’s life based on nothing more than some type of groovy, intuitive feeling that he’s your enemy. Christ, if your fellow third class citizen Danny Boy thinks Germans, faux or otherwise, are risible, he should get a load of you - it takes a mere paragraph or two before the eternal ponderer who plays the role of being above it all is throwing out the mischling talk at people. “Mongrel” this and that. LOL. You sound like a Stormfronter. “What you’ve hit upon, in your one-sided and polemical way, is one of the main difficulties in understanding history: building mental models of the actions-motivations-possibilities-aims of tens, hundreds, thousands and millions of people. Its one of the reasons why I refuse the conclusions of the pro-Hitler historical analysis, that and the gross ignorance of the basic facts which I continue to encounter in these internet researchers.” Here’s my reply: What you’ve hit upon, in your one-sided and polemical way, is one of the main difficulties in understanding history: building mental models of the actions-motivations-possibilities-aims of tens, hundreds, thousands and millions of people. Its one of the reasons why I refuse the conclusions of the anti-Hitler historical analysis, that and the gross ignorance of the basic facts which I continue to encounter in these internet researchers. So anyway, what’s your answer, post-collegiate acolyte? What is England? Give me a definition. Or are you like any of a million other vaguely conservative douches muttering about “Western Civilization”, thinking all along about Beethoven or the Spear Shaker but ignoring poor kids jammed up into chimneys and mass gang rapes? “so confused white mongrels like yourself are going to inherit the earth, is that what you’re sayin’?” Nope. That time’s passed. But I rest easy knowing that the carriers of that wretched Anglo-Saxon hypocrisy that the whole world despises are fading away fast. What’s it like to be a willing slave, bro? To be in a psychological state like yours, I admit, boggles me. Do you walk around that wasted land you live in, pumping your fist and shouting, “Yeah, this is what it’s like to win a world war! We reaped it ALL!”? 42
Posted by Captainchaos on March 21, 2010, 11:03 PM | #
You are, given the odds, as English as I am German, then. I take it that issue can be laid to rest.
Go easy on those Krauts, now. 43
Posted by PF on March 21, 2010, 11:04 PM | # gmander,
I haven’t been to Taiwan, in fact. What would you think if I were to write articles about the history, and the meaning of the history, and the conduct of the peoples of Taiwan, having never been there? That is the point of the quip.
If you want to really go deep into there’s Max Domarus, assuming one reads german. That gives you all the speeches but there isn’t an internet link. The best resource in my opinion is Joachim Fest’s Hitler, where you can get excerpts from speeches time-linked with a narrative of the actual events of the war, and they are selected for pertinence, especially psychological pertinence, with a view to showing the reader how Hitler conceptualized the different players and aspects of the conflicts, which of course was an understanding that evolved throughout the course of his dictatorship. Just reading the speeches all at once in a row is less illuminating because most of it is dross, thats why that book is good. 44
Posted by Al Ross on March 22, 2010, 12:03 AM | # Auf Englisch : http://www.hitler.org/speeches/ Herr Hitler was the only person willing to attempt free Germany from Jewish infestation, so, naturally, any speech toward that desideratum would , for PF, come under the rubric of ‘dross’. 45
Posted by Guest Lurker on March 22, 2010, 12:43 AM | #
46
Posted by Dan Dare on March 22, 2010, 01:08 AM | #
I’m not sure that Herr Hitler was the *only* person willing to attempt such during the period in question but, on the other hand, I’m not aware of any amongst our congregation here who would criticise him for wishing to do so. Anymore than any here would censure Nick Griffin for wishing to be rid of his own troublesome Pakis. Where the difficulty with Herr H arises is with his inclination towards aggressive bullying of his fellow Europeans who for one reason or another didn’t happen to fully buy in to the ‘Master Plan’ within a timeframe that Herr H and his associates deemed appropriate. Who knows, perhaps with some creative diplomacy of the ‘not von Brickendrop’ variety even the recalcitrant Brits might have been brought around in due course, however as the record clearly shows that particular avenue was not chosen. But then as we now all know diplomacy was not the Nazis’ strongest suit. 47
Posted by Lurker on March 22, 2010, 01:13 AM | #
Yeah, this is what it’s like to win a world war! We reaped it ALL!
Oh I suspect a lot of us are thinking along those very lines, and in exactly the ironic way you intended it! Hardly a day goes by where we are not reminded that although everything has turned to dross we still better off - somehow - because those nasty Germans lost the war. 49
Posted by Dan Dare on March 22, 2010, 01:15 AM | #
What about the obligatory 1/8th Cherokee? Every American I have ever met claims to be at least 1/8th Cherokee. Apart from negroes that is. They generally claim to be at least 1/8th Anglo. What a buggers muddle as our antipodean cousins so quaintly put it. No wonder you blokes get so confused about which side to root for. It must be like being a Man Utd fan born in Liverpool. 51
Posted by PF on March 22, 2010, 01:19 AM | # Sorry Guest Lurker, I just read all the stuff once, settled the questions for myself in my mind, and dropped the subject. I don’t have a list of quotes. It would have been a good idea to have anotated all of that, for arguments like this. What would have put into your mind that Fest was a “court historian”? His father was punished by the NSDAP for his involvement in the Weimar republic, so it was a case of family loyalty trumps all. Actually the thing I love most about Fest is the fact that he represents a non-Reich-aligned subtle german nationalism, that is home-grown and rooted in a way Hitler was not, and that has the ability to ask critical questions about Hitler’s tactics from the point of view of “What would have really been best for the Germans?”. One thought that I often read between the lines of the book was: “Is all this frenzy of nationalism good for us?”. Its funny because that thought questions the value of nationalism, but from a nationalist perspective (is it good for us?). Actually I would say it questions teleological nationalism from the point of view of ontological nationalism (will this striving/greatness/circus/frothing-at-the-mouth help us to actually stay alive and thrive?). This is often implied for him, though, so it wont jump out at you all the time. Fest puts work into detailing the German-Jewish antagonism and doesn’t morally condemn, rather he tends to ‘reveal’. Meaning he collates sources to show a certain particular moment - in a way that forces the reader to realize the nature of what has been done. Is it all one prolonged character assassination? I would say not. The attention to details and the realism of it keep one outside the realm of interpretation for most of the book. There is an ambivalence which shows Fest didn’t grow up in Judaized America, obsessed as it is with the question of the moral meaning of the conflict. Anyway, its worth a look. 52
Posted by PF on March 22, 2010, 01:37 AM | # Al Ross wrote:
Well the first part is obviously factually inaccurate, since Herr Hitler was only able to rise to power on the back of an enormous, well-networked anti-semitic movement. He was the only one willing to be dictator, so in that sense he was the only person able to do what you mentioned. Nor do I think that freeing germany from Jewish influence is wrong - it was clearly in their interests! Its dross because… well.. its political speeches! So much of that is rhetorical, lowest-common-denominator, meant to get the blood of barbers and shoe-makers frothing and foaming, and so its not nuanced enough to turn me on. Do you like reading Hitlers’ speeches? Weaponized IQ 120 man never generally ever said anything interesting except some variation of this: Here we are! There they are! They are against us! But I will solve it! Here is how! You can too! They are wrong! Lets do this! Are you with us? Its true and the fact that we dont have it now is disastrous for us.. but ruling the world? With that kind of unsubtlety? Give him a high up position in the bureaucracy and let him put things right from there. I don’t think men of that calibre are fit to command nations, having the sensibility of a glorified plumber or a mechanic. Frederick II of Hohenzollern was fit to command a nation. His struggle with the blockishness of German character is one of the most psychologically interesting events in german history, and prefigures a lot of the dynamics we see both in this historical episode of NS and on the blog. He is celebrated today in germany as one of their true philosopher kings, perhaps the only one. 53
Posted by Dan Dare on March 22, 2010, 01:38 AM | #
My own view on that PF, for what it’s worth, is that the best possible strategy for the Germans to pursue in, say, 1937, would have been to press for a reinstatement of the HRE territorially-wise as of 1806. Had that been pressed for there seems little doubt that it could have been attained, and great Germanic cities like Königsberg, Danzig, Breslau, Prag and Wien would now still be part of a Third Reich living at peace with with its European neighbours. 54
Posted by Dan Dare on March 22, 2010, 01:59 AM | #
Yes indeed.
Snapped by yours truly on a recent visit to Sans Souci. And those really are potatoes. I wonder how many of our resident faux Krauts know what that’s all about. 55
Posted by PF on March 22, 2010, 02:29 AM | # Nice pic Dan! Funny that von Hindenburg would have to bow to Frederick the Great as an unapproachably high worthy (in the older german military tradition of obsequiousness that you’re probably acquainted with), and Adolf famously embarrassed himself at his first meeting with Hindenburg by trying to show as much deference as humanly possible. Yet Frederick, higher than them both on the Old-German-Worthies scale, kicked it with French philosophers and was himself probably homosexual! So where does that leave these posters who think Hitler was great, vis-a-vis Frederick? If the tradition of obsequiousness is to be properly observed, I think they have to avert their gaze from this comments thread, because the photo-of-the-grave simply commands too much respect even to be looked upon. Our eyes are not fit to touch it. Or wait, was he just a weak-kneed literary fairy? So confused! Whats a quarter-kraut to do? 56
Posted by Desmond Jones on March 22, 2010, 02:53 AM | #
It’s little wonder. LOL
As quoted in Iron Kingdom: The Rise and Downfall of Prussia 1600-1947, by Christopher Clark, pp. 252-3. 57
Posted by Al Ross on March 22, 2010, 03:08 AM | # “Diplomacy was not the Nazi’s strongest suit”, may well be true DD. If only they had people as intelligent as Chamberlain’s, right hand man, Lord Dunglass (later Sir Alec Douglas Home) who managed to obtain a Third from Oxford in Modern History. More importantly, however, Dunglass, played First Class Cricket and, in the diplomatic field, this peculiar talent more than compensated for any trifling intellectual difficulties. 58
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 22, 2010, 09:53 AM | # ”In this thread it is also Fred Scrooby demonstrating he also still has love for Hitler’s ghost, which caused me to speak on the issue.” (—PF) I don’t agree it’s in this thread I’ve “demonstrated” what you’re referring to, but in other threads (and I wouldn’t refer it as “still having love for Hitler’s ghost” but you’re being sarcastic so that’s OK, I get your basic point and you’re right). I think I said in a different thread that had I been alive and of age to fight in 1939 and had the understanding of all the relevant issues I have now, I would have volunteered for service in the German Army and if that was not possible, I would have gone to jail rather than fight against Germany when war came in 1941. I think I also said in some other thread that I was a national socialist in the sense in which national socialism describes (and it does) today’s Israel, today’s Japan, and Hitlerian Germany as well as many other governmental set-ups past and present. Since you bring up the problems with this thread, I’ll throw in that the main problem is the log entry itself, a bad entry for the reasons given by all who’ve criticised it including Grimoire. There’s another problem with this thread as I see things, and it’s Dan’s stupid anti-Americanism which he’s given hints of before, under “Dan Dare” and, I also suspect, other pen names (are you “Gongstar,” Dan?). There’s a right way and a wrong way to be anti-American today. I’m anti-American and in my view all right-thinking people the world over are anti-American today because America today is the most evil country that ever existed. I would imagine Al Ross for example — though I don’t recall him ever saying — is surely anti-American for all the right reasons, because he’s a right-thinking gentleman. All right thinking gentlemen today are anti-American for all the right reasons. But a lot of wrong-thinking and, frankly, dimwitted people, especially in Europe — I used to see this when I lived there — are anti-American for reasons that are not only wrong but stupid, and their brand of anti-Americanism is of a type that also applied long before America became, with the 1960s advent of Jewish hegemony, the world’s most evil country, so before there was a valid reason for all their anti-Americanism or at least for anti-Americanism of such intensity as is harbored by some of these stupid dimwitted anti-American Europeans. The Europeans I refer to would be categorized as on the left, further left than what Jim Kalb calls “liberals” and not quite as far left as what David Horowitz (who distinguishes between “liberals” and “leftists”) calls “leftists.” What it boils down to is they’re anti-American basically for lefty reasons that are idiotic (“I can’t stand America because it’s so racially prejudiced” and many other idiotic reasons they cite) and/or untrue (“I can’t stand America because of its high crime rates” [white Americans aren’t committing those crimes] and many other untrue reasons they cite). There are a few valid reasons motivating their anti-Americanism, for example Americans aren’t refined or cultured at all, what mainly appalled Charles Dickens for example among many others (it’s because all the peasants and farmers came here to populate the place: peasants and farmers aren’t refined or cultured). But then these lefty Europeans go around importing the Negro James Brown’s rock and roll “music” which they used to swoon over when I lived there in the ‘70s and ‘80s, or Negro rap music today, and these same anti-Americans who hate America for its lack of culture consider James Brown and rap music the highest cultural achievement since Periclean Athens. So there’s something not quite “firing” among their brain cells. I could go into this European mentality at length; I’m not going to take space or time for that now. I’ll just add that 1) this is one type of European mentality that has given its full backing to the process currently underway of Europe’s total racial negrification and Stalinist EU Sovietization and 2) I suspect it is Dan Dare’s underlying mentality. In DD’s case he’s apparently in the process of partially emerging from that mentality as a result of doubts as to whether or not negrifying itself just so show those horrid Americans how moral, unprejudiced people treat Negroes may not be the best option for the European people after all but he’s still somewhat confused as to which characteristics Americans ought to be loathed for and which are either inoffensive or admirable. Question for PF (whom I suspect is a wet on race): what is the biggest problem facing England? 60
Posted by danielj on March 22, 2010, 02:38 PM | # The greatest irony is that is the very people whose interests they claim to espouse, their co-called deutsche Volksgenossen, who hold them in the greatest contempt of all. This is true of anybody who longs to see any particular white volk saved. Pot, kettle…. 61
Posted by Dasein on March 22, 2010, 02:54 PM | # Without resorting to Google, Friedrich der Grosse introduced the potato to Prussia. Good conversation starter for a date at nearly any restaurant, if you want it. Nice to see Fred back. (BTW, ‘whom’ was correct! Follow your instincts!) 62
Posted by Dasein on March 22, 2010, 03:17 PM | # Have to admit that I also (following Fred, CC, Grimoire) don’t see the point of DD’s German baiting in the OP. Let’s forget the balance of British vs. German civilians killed. Is this resentment about the Germans’ ‘making them fight us, thereby causing us to sacrifice our empire (i.e. adaptive gene flow)?’ 63
Posted by Dasein on March 22, 2010, 03:36 PM | #
64
Posted by Captainchaos on March 22, 2010, 03:55 PM | # I propose that a new logical fallacy be coined in honor of the English, and pathetic mongrels who like to pretend that they are English: argumentum ad snobberyum. 65
Posted by Dan Dare on March 22, 2010, 03:58 PM | # Dasein, I’m surprised to see that you too fail to distinguish between Germans and the Nazi regime. As for taking the mickey, well surely anyone is fair game, and especially the Germans who as I’m sure you are well aware get from it from all quarters, not just the British. The Brits just seem to have honed it to a fine art. I agree it is good to have Fred back and on such top form, the board has lacked a little brio of late. The anti-Americanism he highlights is perhaps be something that could more productively be taken up in more detail elsewhere, although if memory serves there was a thread on that same subject not that long ago. 66
Posted by Captainchaos on March 22, 2010, 04:14 PM | # Three points I think should be non-controversial: 1. The end results of WWII ushered in the new order which is liquidating our race. 2. Nazism and the Holohoax, which are foundational elements in myth of that new order, are used to bludgeon Whites into submission as they are represented as being the inevitable, logical extension of the assertion of White peoplehood. 3. Those who attempt to triangulate against Nazism cut their own throats to spite the Krauts. What you are really say is, “I wish my people to live, but if it comes to it, I will not resist too strenuously as unacceptable moral consequences would flow from that, in which case it is better to die.” 67
Posted by Captainchaos on March 22, 2010, 04:18 PM | #
Dare has in the past voiced even his tacit contempt for the English working class, even his own relatives in that class! That’s just the way he’s cut, whataya gonna do? 68
Posted by Dan Dare on March 22, 2010, 04:21 PM | # Alte Fritz’ ecumenicism as cited by Al above didn’t seem to have dampened the ardour of one of his celebrated admirers:
And who indeed could forget the poignant scene in Downfall in which der Führer (Bruno Ganz), knowing that the barbarians were within the gate, gazes beseechingly at Graff’s famous portrait, perhaps in the hope that he might invoke a second ‘Brandenburg Miracle’. 69
Posted by Dasein on March 22, 2010, 04:30 PM | # Dan, I don’t believe that I fail to distinguish between the two. The OP was perhaps intended as chum for ‘faux Nazis,’ but it’s attracted another, at least equally undesirable, species of comment. Let’s for once, though, see you take the piss out of the British. Do you come to Germany to collect photos that can be used to mock German heroes? I don’t think you do, but that’s the impression you give. 70
Posted by Dan Dare on March 22, 2010, 04:45 PM | # Which German heroes do you believe I have been mocking Dasein? As far as I recall just two prominent dead Germans have appeared in this thread, and only one of those could by any reasonable measure be termed ‘heroic’. If my contribution in that respect is perceived to be mocking then I apologise unreservedly. But I think that even one’s heroes should not be immune from satire or mickey-taking, they are after all mere men and not deities. 71
Posted by Q on March 22, 2010, 05:29 PM | #
Clarity too. 72
Posted by Al Ross on March 22, 2010, 06:36 PM | # I think, Fred, that you understand my position on the US very well. American (and not only American) minds that have been so debilitated by decades of poisonous propaganda that they can believe in racial equality will swallow any kind of media - promoted ordure and this saddens me greatly. 73
Posted by PF on March 22, 2010, 07:10 PM | #
The respect for a grave-site, which we all know is stone laying on top of the body of a man you never met, Underneath the guise of this conversation, deceitfully spun to look as if it were about German history, we are discussing two fundamentally different concepts of man and what it means to be human. One ends in ‘greatness’, and the other doesn’t. 74
Posted by Al Ross on March 22, 2010, 07:29 PM | # There is a difference, PF, between bullshit and nonsense. Stick to bullshit, please. 75
Posted by Captainchaos on March 22, 2010, 07:33 PM | # The words of Joachim Fest:
His book is definitely a must read. PF says:
LOL! PF, you oily little bastard, just why the hell were you so insistent that I go visit those very graves then, eh?
That must be a Freudian slip. 76
Posted by Gorboduc on March 22, 2010, 08:19 PM | # I’ve taken a couple of days off, and return to find that issues are, as so frequently here, confused and fuzzified by a careless use of language that’s sometimes so imprecise as to convey minimum meaning.
A misunderstanding is ensconced within a belief, which is then seen as a treat inside a shell. The misunderstanding is “sweet” and enables us to live outside image hierarchies, whatever they may be, and to forget about greatness - meaning it’s good to live in ignorance and stupidity? That, I’m afraid, is the exoteric significance of what’s set down. Now let us have some clarity.
77
Posted by Al Ross on March 22, 2010, 08:34 PM | # Joachim Fest was not satisfied with Germany’s post war, bastardstate subservience to Jew-promoted, American enforced ‘anti Nazi-ism’. According to the Fest obituary in The Guardian - ” Fest was a tireless critic of contemporary German society, accusing it of failing to establish clearer values as a safeguard against the emergence of another Hitler”. And from the same source : ‘Fest was good friends with Ulrike Meinhof, the Red Army Faction terrorist”. Of course, Fest’s being a “devout Roman Catholic” and a lifelong proponent of ‘Democracy’ caused him to agonize long and hard over the totally undemocratic nature of the Church’s dictatorial governance. Er, no. 78
Posted by PF on March 22, 2010, 08:48 PM | # From “Joachim Fest, a controversial conservative”: Freundschaft mit Meinhof Stattdessen suchte er andere politische Auseinandersetzungen: Ausgerechnet mit Ulrike Meinhof, der späteren RAF-Terroristin, verband ihn eine Freundschaft. «Mit wenigen machte es so viel Vergnügen zu streiten wie mit Ulrike Meinhof», erinnerte sich Fest. «Jedes Mal, wenn wir uns irgendwo bei einer Party trafen, zogen wir uns in eine Ecke zurück und redeten über Politik.» —— So he worked for the CDU and liked to argue about politics with Ulrike Meinhof. The first sentence of this paragraph reads “Fest didnt let himself be shoehorned into a political camp”. Is that your attempt at understanding him, Al Ross? 79
Posted by Al Ross on March 22, 2010, 09:11 PM | # The other week, PF, I was walking down a suburban lane and I noticed a small Black Cobra moving across my path. I would no more attempt to understand the snake than I would try get to grips with the origins of Fest’s unappeasable hatred of his fellow Germans. However,any endeavour in this regard would surely commence by addressing the vexed question of whether the etiology of the old auto - racist, Fest’s loathing of his tribe was due to his being a) a psychopath or b) a sociopath. In any event, Fest is, doubtless, safely ensconced in old Yahweh’s stratospheric Heaven along with the rest of the anti - Nazi heroes. 80
Posted by Gorboduc on March 22, 2010, 09:19 PM | # PF, the “Catholics” who are crying out for the democritisation of the Church are the ones you would like even less than you like the bow-the-knee slave-minded retards like myself, who believe in miracles 81
Posted by Captainchaos on March 22, 2010, 09:28 PM | #
You hint at some new horizon of profound understanding if only we were to come to grips with old Holohoaxing Fester. Pure, unadulterated horseshit. And a little humility is called for, PF, you just read the book, you didn’t write. Although I’m sure you wish you had, were it within repertoire of skills, which it is not. 82
Posted by Gorboduc on March 22, 2010, 09:30 PM | # One gay marriage was quite enough. Sorry. 83
Posted by Hitler the Pacifist? on March 22, 2010, 09:36 PM | # “Hitler sought ‘cordial relations’ with UK” London, England (CNN)—A letter written by Adolf Hitler in 1931 hoping for a “truly cordial relationship” between Britain and Germany goes on sale Tuesday and is estimated to fetch up to £12,000 at auction. The one-page letter was addressed to Sefton Delmer, a British journalist, in which Hitler expressed hopes of a new friendship between the two countries to replace the “unhappy war-psychosis” that existed after the First World War: Hitler wrote the letter 16 months before he became chancellor and seized power in 1933. In the letter he said: “I hope… that out of this crisis a new readiness will grow up in Britain to submit the past twelve years to a reappraisal. I should be happy, if as a result of this the unhappy war-psychosis could be overcome on such a scale as to permit the realization of the truly cordial relationship between the British and the German peoples so eagerly desired by myself and my movement. ... - http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/europe/03/22/germany.hitler.letter.cordial/index.html 84
Posted by g on March 22, 2010, 09:48 PM | # Sefton Delmer, eh? Not a good choice, a real Slithy Tove as anyone who’s read Ellic Howe’s book on Allied disinformation techniques The Black Game will remember. 85
Posted by Al Ross on March 22, 2010, 10:04 PM | # I (mistakenly?) have always taken Delmer to be a Red Sea Pedestrian and treated his Jewish Jabberwocky with the caution appropriate to that baneful source. 86
Posted by Gorboduc on March 22, 2010, 10:34 PM | # I should think his shoes are still wet and sandy, Al. 87
Posted by Gorboduc on March 22, 2010, 10:37 PM | # Sorry, wrong url above. if you can stand it. 88
Posted by Dan Dare on March 22, 2010, 10:41 PM | # Wasn’t it Hitler the cordial pacifist whose ‘Second Book’ (written in 1927 but later suppressed) looked forward to a grand coalition of the German and British Empires in a forthcoming contest for global hegemony with the United States? In effect, Hitler argued that following the defeat of the Soviet Union, the final global struggle would take place later in the 20th Century between the combined powers of the new Greater Germany (with its new territories in the East) and the British Empire against the United States. He viewed the United States as a particularly dangerous adversary because of its character as a fundamentally ‘racially fit’ Aryan state which was under the effective control of the international Jewish plutocracy. How does the prospect of that scenario go down with the resident faux Krauts? 89
Posted by Captainchaos on March 22, 2010, 10:45 PM | #
Death to Amerikwa! 90
Posted by Al Ross on March 22, 2010, 10:46 PM | # “I hope it’s not going to catch on like some of the various - ologies” Well, it can’t hurt to hope. I should, perhaps, have gone for ‘enraptured’ as ‘le mot juste’ when referring to the eventual abode of MR’s heaven - bound contingent. 91
Posted by Lurker on March 22, 2010, 11:00 PM | #
And that analysis was wrong in what respect? 92
Posted by sudso on March 23, 2010, 12:24 AM | # “I haven’t been to Taiwan, in fact. What would you think if I were to write articles about the history, and the meaning of the history, and the conduct of the peoples of Taiwan, having never been there? That is the point of the quip.” Shows yet again an incredible failure to grasp reality or, at the very least, subpar quipping. You’d deny someone legitimacy on historical topics because they’ve never been to the place in question? Post-grad, have you read any history book at all outside of Fest’s over-the-top Revenge of the Nerd screed? Suddenly Henry Adams can’t write about the rotting away of Rome and medieval England because, uh, he wasn’t in either place. Couldn’t make it. Mommsen and a hundred other German classicists can’t be taken seriously, nor can Gibbon. Will Durant, sorry to inform you, but PF has to heavily edit your Story of Civilization - most of it’s invalid under the new rules. Carlyle, your little book about France is now declared worthless. Goodbye studies of ancient Egypt and Persia and ancient any place written by anyone after the fact. Oh, and say so long to higher criticism - guess we’ll just have to accept the bible as it was written. Nice try Wellhausen. Why, even the old school guys aren’t immune under the bizzare criterion Potential Frolic has set - Herodotus, did you REALLY make it to Scythia, chappie? 93
Posted by Dan Dare on March 23, 2010, 01:16 AM | #
Was there an implication on my part that it was? I believe I am on record here and elsewhere as proposing that the greatest tragedy of the 20th century was the failure to create an Anglo-German Accord. From that failure, which predates AH’s emergence, all else ensued. Actually, my own view is that the roots of the tragedy lie a little earlier, in Wilhelm II’s decision to jettison Bismarckian Realpolitik in favour of his illusory ‘Place in the Sun’.
Dropping the Pilot 94
Posted by Grimoire on March 23, 2010, 01:42 AM | # I will point out in Germany anyone with one German grandparent or parent is considered a German and entitled to citizenship. Immigrants and their children along with Aussiedler, Evacuees and those caught behind hostile borders are in this category. An American with one German grandparent then, is legally correct to call himself German. An American with distant German blood, is also to be considered for application for citizenship by virtue of this heredity, by our law, and is to my mind a fellow German. As for Americans, I have lived and travelled everywhere in Europe and much of Asia and Africa. I have lived in America for a decade and have travelled in every state and major city in the US and the same for Canada. My opinion of them is they are as good as any, and better than many Europeans of the continent. The stereotype of southern and middle Americans as ignorant and uneducated rustics are cliches. My first 6 years here were spent in the gulf states of the deep south. Anyone living of Germany or England would be embarrassed by the life and soundness of these people, their instincts, their way of life. The people of the midwest have a courtliness and gentle hospitality and a rooted intelligence to match that of Europe of any age. 95
Posted by Dan Dare on March 23, 2010, 02:50 AM | # An interesting post Grimoire and one which touches on some very salient issues. Like yourself, I have a foot in both camps as it were and agree that, although we should look to history for important lessons, it is to the future that we must direct our concern. The fundamental question in my mind is whether we, as Europeans, should be concerning ourselves with the future direction of America as a state in which persons of European descent will quite soon be a numerical minority and what the implications of that will be in terms of the face it presents to the ‘Old World’. While you are certainly correct in stating that in regions of the country the population still consists of reliable yeoman stock it is unfortunately the case that in other parts, which happen to be those in which the demographic transformation is most evident, a majority of the population already has no particular affinity towards Europe or Europeans. Their affiliations are directed towards their own ancestral homelands in Asia, Africa or Hispanic America. This is not to denigrate the still sizeable albeit relatively dwindling European-American population. It may be a couple of generations or more before ‘Atlanticists’ become a minority amongst the cognitive elite but that seems bound to happen within the lifetime of our grandchildren if not our children themselves. 96
Posted by Grimoire on March 23, 2010, 06:02 AM | # In the best case, without appeal to the loyalties of the European Americans, or even if only to the European heritage of America, we will neither succeed nor survive. In the worst case, any single ameliorating factor needs to be guarded and attended, as we will be facing untold difficulties. I do not suggest we become pagan. but the ideal, the virtues of the Republic. Any man a Roman by blood, was a citizen and freeman of the City and Empire. Further in this, any man who is European by blood, is a citizen and freeman of the European Republic. The ideals and the virtues of the Republic and classical Rome, this is has always been much of the best of what we are. It is the wellsprings of our civilization. If you read the chroniclers of this Rome, you read the thoughts of men who are completely modern, they are us. In many ways, they are beyond us, they are us in our future, in clarity, virtue, insight and honesty and frankness of thought. They were respecters of religion and the graces of the hearth, yet completely without superstition. Universal in thought, their mind was open to all things, but their loyalty was to Rome, to each other. 97
Posted by the Narrator... on March 23, 2010, 06:14 AM | #
According to good ol’ Wikipedia, England (in 2007) was 83% “white-British”, which is down about 4 percentage points from just six years earlier. Given the British government’s track record on “full disclosure” on all things immigrant related, I’d speculate that that 83% represents the high end of the estimate. And given the relatively small size of your country (about the size of the state of Virginia), the low birth rates of native English people, the ongoing flood of foreigners and the Orwellian/Sovietesque nature of it’s society, England (and I say this not to engage in the rhetorical back and forth pissings in this thread) looks to be the first Western nation to crumble. It or Holland. But all of Europe is in immediate danger, hence the term “Eurabia”.
It’s important to remember that even though our PERCENTAGE of the total is dropping, our numbers are actually increasing, heading for the 200,000,000 mark. If we expand the parameters to North Americans (thus counting White Canadians) we’re already past that mark now. How can you guys not see that in the post-1945 paradigm, the English are histories greatest “Nazis”? Ever notice that in Hollywood media (which shapes the views of billions of people) the really bad guys have English accents, not German ones? I mean, come on, you guys were the ones running the Death Star, for crying out loud! Even in ‘Schindler’s List’ they got an Irishman to play the “good” German and an Englishman to play the “evil” German. And who can forget Mel Gibson’s ‘The Patriot’ where the English locked men, women and children into a church and burned them alive. Don’t you understand that this is how the world sees you? And probably (and more importantly) how many of your young people see themselves. When people think of slave-traders they don’t picture the Spanish or Dutch or French, they immediately see an Englishman. In other words, Hitler’s “sin” (in the post-1945 paradigm) was that he was attempting to emulate the English. And this carries over into America where the really “evil” deeds in American history (racism, slavery, ethnic cleansing of the Indians) was carried out when the elite were Anglo-Saxons. Ditto South Africa and Australia. You want to go out in the country and shoot at old soup cans, fine. hmmmm. Well, It seems to range from “highbrow” (that being a man dressed in woman’s clothing) to “lowbrow” (that being a fat man dressed in woman’s clothing) with little room for subtlety in between. Still, that’s better than the French. They actually thought Jerry Lewis was funny. ... 98
Posted by Grimoire on March 23, 2010, 07:04 AM | # The fundamental question in my mind is whether we, as Europeans, should be concerning ourselves with the future direction of America as a state in which persons of European descent will quite soon be a numerical minority and what the implications of that will be in terms of the face it presents to the ‘Old World’. This is a danger. But even as those of European descent become a minority, for any foreseeable future the entire mechanism of power within America lies in the hands of those of European descent. America is still the America of British and European heritage, and will be for many generations. The growing population of non European immigrants constitute little but disorder. The black population is as indigenous as the European, but without interference is not a threat to European Americans, if law is upheld for both. In Central and South America, the middle class and the elite all claim European blood - I have seen many of those of what appeared to be full blooded medioclase claim on their mothers grave to be pure Spanish, or Italian or Portugese. In S.America if you are European, you are automatically elite. It is possible that they would be our allies in a struggle for national determination. As they are fully aware of the degradations manifested at the hands of the global elite….resistance to same has their approval. Many people observe with anxiety the power of those of the tribe. Their power there as here, is a mirage of the thinnest tissue. It is omnipresent and influential, yet like being choked by a child of 10, the slightest concerted effort would split it top to bottom. In the past their power was always hidden, now it is in the open in confidence it is invisible. It remains to be seen how long this will last. 99
Posted by INFO on March 23, 2010, 09:44 AM | #
The problem with the American South is the heat, which has quite adverse long term effects (mental, physical, etc) on Whites in the region. Whites did not evolve to stand such heat and strong amounts of sunlight: http://www.archive.org/details/cu31924029901208 - this is of course why Whites in the South had to have Sub-Saharan African slaves to work in the hotter months of the year, because Whites are simply incapable of doing so to any great extent because they aren’t built to tolerate too much heat. The Midwest is interesting, especially the more northerly portions, because it is similar to the windswept grasslands of central-northern-eastern Europe upon which many Nordids evolved. So it is good territory - and whoever controls the temperate grasslands on Earth will reign supreme:
100
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 09:58 AM | # I would say The Narrator’s response to Dan shows he senses the same underlying intense anti-Americanism in Dan — anti-Americanism for the wrong reasons (again, all right-thinking men today are anti-American but for the right reasons, not the wrong, stupid, European lefty-type ones) — which I sense and have sensed starting when Dan commented here before as “Gongstar” and “Nux Gnomica.” It’s the sort of stupid anti-Americanism which, if you put to Dan the question, “Which is worse, Americans or race-replacement?” he’d answer without a microsecond’s hesitation, “Americans!” Yes Americans are plenty bad (I’m talking exclusively of European-race Americans, not non-white U.S. citizens of any variety who don’t enter the picture in this context) but not bad in the sense in which fundamentally lefty America-hating Europeans like Dan imagine. They’re bad in other ways (and are actually good in the ways Dan sees them as bad — in the ways Dan sees them as bad they’re some of the best folk in the world in fact, yes precisely in the ways Dan sees white Americans as bad they’re damned good folk, so Dan misses the whole boat as regards the ways in which Americans are bad or good, getting everything ridiculously Euro-lefty ass-backwards: I lived in Europe a little over eleven years and I know this European type extremely well). But I won’t get futher into that because we’re not here for that. I will say though that as long as Dan “fundamentally-lefty-fundamentally-anti-American-for-all-the-wrong-fundamentally-lefty-reasons” Dare sees America as a bigger evil than race-replacement it’s going to be hard to have a meeting of the minds with him on precisely the topic at hand, the race-replacement crisis, unless he keeps away from America-related issues. In general, when Americans open their mouths, Dan looks in their direction with more of a scowl on his face than when he looks at David Cameron saying there are too many white faces among Tory candidates for Parliament or David Blunkett saying his government saw “no upper limit” to non-white immgration into Britain. That can make it hard for Americans to participate when Dan’s in the room: where Amercans are concerned, Dan basically “disapproves.” 101
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 10:04 AM | # Some GREAT follow-up commentary in this thread by Grimoire, incidentally — some of Grimoire’s best I’ve seen. Speaking of which, Grimoire, you told GW you would put together some of your ideas on Darwin-critique for a main log entry. Have you had time to work on that? I’d love to see it (though I have never doubted Darwinian evolution and am skeptical I could be pesuaded otherwise) (yes I am both a Christian and a believer in Darwinian evolution — I see zero contradiction between the two). 102
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 10:07 AM | # Zero contradiction because, very simply, I see what God created in his image as man’s immortal soul, and what evolved merely the mortal husk, the clay. Man’s immortal soul remains scietifically a complete and utter mystery of the deepest sort — only religion can explain it. 103
Posted by Armor on March 23, 2010, 10:34 AM | #
Among French pseudo-intellectuals, I think the reputation of Jerry Lewis as a good humorist was mainly built by Jews. For example, he received a medal from Jack Lang, the Jewish French minister of Culture, in 1984. 104
Posted by Armor on March 23, 2010, 12:05 PM | #
I like ‘Europistan’ better, as the word isn’t officially approved by the neocons. Eurafrica is good too.
At least, I’m glad to know that the English finally see themselves as European!
I get the same impression reading some Western authors who wrote in the 1930s against immigration and against Jewish influence. But I also get some of that impression when I read some passages from the New Testament. Today, outside the internet, the leftist hegemony makes frank, intelligent analysis impossible to come by. I like the insight and frankness of thought of the Romans (at least, I suppose I would, if I did read their books), but not their imperialism. I don’t think they brought much to England by conquering it. The greatness of Europe is in its genes, not in Rome’s cultural influence. Greece (except Alexander the Great) is even better than Rome, because it stayed small. It was a small world with a huge concentration of powerful minds. They were able to think, decide and live for themselves, whereas today, there isn’t a single little town in the Western world, with the confidence to think for itself, and the guts to declare its independence and refuse race-replacement. 105
Posted by Dasein on March 23, 2010, 01:23 PM | # Apologies to DD and PF if my comments yesterday came across as rough. And sorry too, to Fred, for unconsciously substituting ‘is’ with ‘of being’ (hopefully, given my pseudonym, this can be forgiven 106
Posted by Dan Dare on March 23, 2010, 01:25 PM | # Fred, you seem to be impervious to nuance. My comments about America are not concerned with the merits of white Americans (which are considerable as individuals and as a group) but with the relationship between a future America in which the majority of the population will have no ancestral connection to Europe and Europe itself. As noted elsewhere, I view America’s transformation as a tragedy for the descendants of the people who created the society but I believe it is incumbent on Europeans to carefully consider the potential effect of that transformation and to take appropriate collective action to safeguard their own (ethnic) interest. Grimoire is correct that, at present, even in places like California where whites have been a minority for more than a decade already, they still retain economic and political control. However such control, especially the political component, can only be maintained by yet further pandering to ethnic rent-seeking. An important part of that ongoing process is that ever-increasing numbers of ethnics are encouraged to challenge for political office, the white elites obviously believing that such ‘house’ ethnics will be gratefully pliant and malleable. That may well be the case at present but in future generations? Who will be performing the accultuturation when whitey isn’t around anymore? Somewhere like San Francisco, say, where only around ten percent of children in public school are white. I won’t be responding to Narrator. 107
Posted by aug on March 23, 2010, 02:14 PM | # sudso, You’d deny someone legitimacy on historical topics because they’ve never been to the place in question? You’re right, but also wrong. PF is trying to point out that CaptainChaos is a daydreamer with no real experience of the “glyph” Germany / Germans, which, if he had, would perhaps soften the tone of his rabid follower’s rhetoric. I’m sure PF would excuse the great learned men of yore for hazarding historical analysis and synopsis, given that they were learned, dispassionate (obv. not Carlyle!), and not grinding an axe at the level of the resident neo-Nazi toad. Herodotus writing about the Scythians isn’t CaptainChaos soiling his shorts over the Germans; the one was trying, albeit through a fog of misinformation and Hellenic prejudice, to report to contemporaries and future generations the facts of the world as he found it—not to bully everyone else into accepting the Scythians’ way of life, much less the way of life of a people defeated in a titanic battle seventy years before his account. Fundamentally different ventures. In S.America if you are European, you are automatically elite Can’t remember who said this, but it’s characteristic of white nationalist ethnography. Go to Brazil and try telling the blond sertanejos or garimpeiros they’re “automatically elite”. Or hey, go to Antioquia up in Colombia, take any blue-eyed paisa you find by the shoulders and tell him the same, if he isn’t too drunk by 5pm to understand a word of what you’re saying. It is possible that they would be our allies in a struggle for national determination. Or they would laugh at the pompous gringos who don’t speak even speak their language. 108
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 02:59 PM | # “Fred, you seem to be impervious to nuance.” (—Dan) I stand by what I wrote, Dan. Your entire comment of 5:25 is trivial because it goes without saying. Why did you post it? Of course once the Jews’ dream has come true and the United States is one-hundred percent mystery meat no European nation will continue dealing with it as it dealt with it when it was white. Do nations deal with Haiti the way they deal with Russia? And would they deal with Russia the same way if it had Haitians instead of Russians for a population? What you “pointed out” (as if it came as news to anyone) holds equally true once England, France, Holland, Belgium, Sweden, or Jewrmany becomes one-hundred percent mystery meat. We’re going to deal with Jewrmany the same way once its population is, thanks to Jewish hard work and dedication, made the same as Haiti’s??? Of course we won’t and who didn’t know that? And your point is? We already knew that, Dan. “Knowing that” is another word for stuff like “spending the last five fricking years on this blog talking about it every day.” I mean, please correct me but isn’t that what we’ve all been doing???? What are we doing here, having a barbecue? That’s the whole fricking point of what everyone here has been saying from day one, Dan. No, your utterly trivial, needless, ridiculous pointing that out the way you did sprang from your intense, stupid, lefty-type European anti-Americanism. Case fricking closed. 109
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 03:11 PM | # Dan Dare places anti-Americanism above anti-race-replacement in importance. CC does nothing of the kind. Of all the people who participate at this blog including PF, that’s solely Dan Dare’s gig. 110
Posted by Dan Dare on March 23, 2010, 03:36 PM | # What I am arguing Fred is on a altogether higher plane. It is, in a nutshell, that the Atlanticist era is drawing to a close and that Europeans (Britons and Germans, especially) should remove their blinkers, accept that eventuality and take appropriate political action (including military) to deal with its consequences. There is nothing that any of us here, or Europeans in general, or even white Americans en bloc can do to avoid or even defer the inevitable denouement, with the single, unlikely exception that if white Americans should collectively decide at some future point to recapture their own country, a completely different scenario unfolds. And to attempt to equate the demographic situation in Europe with that in North America is futile. The US in particular is already past the point of no return - even if all third world immigration were to cease tomorrow that would merely defer Euro-minority status for a another decade or so. Europe, on the other hand, and here I refer to geographic Europe not just the EU, still has time to avoid a US-style catastrophe, the non-white population at present being of similar proportions to that of the US prior to the 1965 Immigration Act. But there is clearly little time to waste, and this is the principal reason that I continue to argue for the creation of a self-sufficient autarkic Festung Europa to supersede both NATO and the present EU. To my mind the preservation of the heartland with its 800 million native population is of paramount importance and, if that entails leaving the New World diaspora to its own devices, then so be it. 111
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 04:12 PM | # More of the same, what everyone knew and the same goes in reverse, what everyone also knew, and the whole reason we’re here in the first place, and everything I said stands. Dan gets the last word. 112
Posted by Dan Dare on March 23, 2010, 04:16 PM | # And yet you still persist in characterising my position as ‘anti-Americanism’ and ‘pro race-replacement’, which is perverse. 113
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 04:20 PM | # In general Dan’s going to place a certain kind of dumb European anti-Americanism above opposition to race-replacement in importance — or at the very least precisely equal to race-replacement in importance. Every American just needs to be aware of that about Dan otherwise he’ll tick you off and you’ll tick him off. 114
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 04:23 PM | # “And yet you still persist in characterising my position as ‘anti-Americanism’ “ Absolutely, it’s glaring it’s so obvious. But more specifically it’s a particular kind of dumb European anti-Americanism. It’s right to be anti-American in today’s world. But not for dumb reasons. 115
Posted by Captainchaos on March 23, 2010, 04:29 PM | # Even now Dare is being less than forthright. He realizes, but will only hint at, that White Americans in the hands of their Jewish ruling class are a all conquering weapon that could, were the latter able to wield the former to that end, totally crush and end any last hope that Europeans have of securing their genetic survival. Unfortunately he does not seem to fully internalize that the Jews will NEVER allow Europe to go nationalist if it is in their power to prevent it. He is, however, aware of it on some level, which is why he tacitly hopes for White Americans to be passively destroyed in a sea of mongrelization, before the point at which they could be weaponized against Europe. Further, and at some level, he realizes that there will still be a sufficient number of White men left, even a century hence, and certainly before then, to flesh out the armies which would be used to smash and occupy Europe paving the way permanently unobstructed for the genetic annihilation of Europeans. But, instead of manfully facing the truth, and casting his lot in with us for the higher good of the race, loyal unto death, he would rather entertain fantasies of standing against the unopposable and of our destruction. It is precisely the same lack of character and vision that led the Anglo-American powers to smash Germany. Germany’s burden has now passed to White America. Either we will win here or our race will perish globally. 116
Posted by Dan Dare on March 23, 2010, 04:30 PM | # Perhaps if you were able to progress beyond facile sloganeering and address yourself to the kernel of my argument, and in particular the demographic and geopolitical assumptions it is based on, your charges might carry more weight. 117
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 04:32 PM | # “CC does nothing of the kind.” (—from my comment) Meaning of course he does nothing of the kind “in reverse.” CC holds no Euro-race population or nation so blameworthy that he places contempt for it above opposition to race-replacement in importance. None, obviously. And no, not even England however much he rails. He’s on white people’s side all the way, no exceptions. 118
Posted by Dan Dare on March 23, 2010, 04:36 PM | # You’ve made that argument before Cap’n but it founders on the shoals of reality, like so much of your comic book cod-Stormfront rhetoric. 119
Posted by Captainchaos on March 23, 2010, 05:01 PM | # Just how many White men would it take to get the job done of putting the final nail in Europe’s coffin? I’d say two million White front-line troops, with as many muds as you can imagine piled in afterwards for mop up and occupation (and to claim the remaining White women of breeding age as spoils of war).
Assuming White Americans cannot be galvanized to stand for themselves, I expect mud elites to pursue their ethnic interests within the context of the greater North American empire that will come into being. It will manifestly be in the interests of those mud elites to allow themselves to be co-opted into that empiric vision. Why would they want to smash that gravy train with balkanization? And a whole continent of “Nazis” in the form of a Europe gone nationalist - and you can expect the Jews to play that angle to the hilt - would be viewed as a existential threat to that gravy train that they, working with the Jews and White race traitors, would never even allow to materialize. If they will smash Iraq and Iran, they will do as such with Europe, or at a very minimum subvert so as to make impossible nationalist gains throught the democratic process in Europe. Bank on it. 120
Posted by PF on March 23, 2010, 05:23 PM | # Thanks Dan, for lending some support to the skeptical viewpoint. It feels like we’re partners in a zombie-shooter game. 121
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 06:27 PM | # In one sentence, PF, what’s the bigget problem facing your country England? 122
Posted by Guessedworker on March 23, 2010, 06:37 PM | # CC, No doubt the “Anglo-American powers” smashed Germany because their criminal Jewish-Zionist banker-paymasters seductively whispered war-psychopathy into the always obedient ears of the formerly peaceable, indeed hopelessly peaceable Mr Chamberlain, or we must presume it was Mr Chamberlain since Winnie was in the wilderness and Neville it was who straightened his spine at last and declared war. The British people, however, fought Germans because they saw a goose-stepping, militarised monstrosity which they couldn’t possible respect, and which they refused to fear, bouncing around the place and pursuing its dreams of vainglory through violence, threats and bullying. And that sort of thing always goes down terribly badly with Brits. Especially when Dad’s generation had put Gerry in his place once, and he still hadn’t got the message. They didn’t much like their Prime Minister being humiliated on the international stage either, when he had gone as far as any statesman possibly could for what they all firmly desired: peace. Their self-belief, their war-will came from this very British cocktail of grit and disdain. If you don’t recognise that you are badly out of touch with the British one-fourth of you! 123
Posted by Al Ross on March 23, 2010, 06:43 PM | # Fred, in dealing with a certain type of Englishman, you often find that, ideologically, he has no particular approach to a given discussion, being content instead to establish his ‘superiority’ to the general run of play, however difficult this last may be. 124
Posted by Al Ross on March 23, 2010, 06:50 PM | # GW, we must thank Providence that, unlike the nasty Germans, the British Empire (and its concomitant activities such as the China narcotics trade) eschewed “dreams of vainglory through violence, threats and bullying”. 125
Posted by Guessedworker on March 23, 2010, 07:23 PM | # As far as I am aware, Al, in 1939 the men of North Bucks labouring in the LMS works in Wolverton and on their allotments in Stony Stratford were as far removed from the narcotics trade in 19th century China as they were from the black and brown uniformities of 20th century Munich, and would have been equally disdainful of both. 126
Posted by Armor on March 23, 2010, 07:47 PM | # “the black and brown uniformities of 20th century Munich” How is it worse to use a fascist militia to reclaim one’s country, than to have a conventional army stage a war against the neighboring country? 127
Posted by Al Ross on March 23, 2010, 07:52 PM | # That may well be so, GW, but their military forebears in the 14th Buckinghamshire Regiment (Prince of Wales’s Own Regiment of Foot) were rightly honoured for their role in the capture of Java from the Dutch in the 1810/11 war. 128
Posted by PF on March 23, 2010, 07:59 PM | #
The biggest problem facing England is the influx of non-English people thats happened since 129
Posted by Captainchaos on March 23, 2010, 08:07 PM | # Moral outrage and altruistic punishment come cheap, for awhile. There are two questions one need ask one’s self regarding my scenario of America disallowing European nationalism: 1.) Will America not accept nationalism in Europe to take root or to remain rooted? 2.) Is it within America’s power to stop European nationalism taking root or remaining rooted? If “yes” to both of those questions, my scenario is vindicated. And what would Russia being doing while all this was going on? Can Western Europe expect to be able to climb up under Russia’s walnuts for protection? Would Russia be willing to risk nuclear war to defend Western Europe? Not a chance in hell. America would be willing to hand over Eastern Europe back into the Russian sphere of influence as the ransom paid for Russia’s standing aside, and the Russians would take it. All those rednecks in those Red States are our last hope. And if we can’t count on them to rise to the challenge, I mean to crush our enemies totally, with the prospect of changing things by democratic means now a pipe dream with the demographic situation as bad as it is with amnesty for illegal aliens just around the corner, then we have nothing. Whites will then be as hostages, as slaves held by a coalition of muds led by Jews, who will use them at the last to batter the gates down in Europe. 130
Posted by Armor on March 23, 2010, 08:08 PM | #
Both the European and American population should remove their blinkers and get rid of their present governments. Until then, I expect the European and American governments will keep getting on well together. If a pro-white revolution breaks out next year in Britain and Germany, I expect the US army will be asked to leave the European territory. It will be the end of “the Atlanticist era”. Then, Britain and Germany will start funding the white resistance movement in the USA: internet websites, newspapers, televisions, schools, and white community centers in the Oregon. The first week, I suggest an allowance of $1000 to F.Scrooby, $100 to the Narrator, $100 to Tanstaafl, $10 to Captain Chaos, and so on. As an Englishman living in a free country, D.Dare will be expected to foot part of the bill. 131
Posted by Guessedworker on March 23, 2010, 08:13 PM | # Al, The greatest feat of arms by the men of North Bucks, from whom I spring, was by the Territorials of the 1st Bucks Batallion - so not even professional soldiers - who landed in France with the BEF in January 1940. Their last stand began on 25th May at Hazebrouck, to the south of Dunkirk. Under orders to hold back the German advance in the area while the evacuation proceded they stood fast for four days. At the end, surrounded by enemy tanks and artillery and their ammunition expended, they made a break under cover of darkness. Of the original battalion strength of 800 only 10 officers and around 200 ORs arrived on the beach to find a birth home. Not that anyone remembers that now. We are supposed to greet everything Third Reichish as if it was imbued with some superior morality ... or worse, that the German tanks and troops were really fighting for us, and but for our stupidity and unending kraut-hatred, and but for the power of Jewish Hollywood, we would understand where virtue and the blessing of the race truly lay. None of which I buy for one second. Armor, all war is bad. 133
Posted by PF on March 23, 2010, 08:23 PM | # Grimoire wrote:
Then both CC and myself are germans. In fact, just about everyone in the US is a german by these standards. 134
Posted by PF on March 23, 2010, 08:34 PM | # We’ve all been sprayed with this hose - polluted with the squarehead’s blood. Who here is free from the stain? 135
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 08:34 PM | # PF has just accomplished what no one else has succeeded in doing in the nine years I’ve been posting comments online (though many of the best have tried): shutting me up. And he did it in a single sentence. (See his last comment above). My hat’s off to you, mate. Good work. 137
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 08:38 PM | # That single sentence he posted is also one of the most beautiful single sentences ever posted online anywhere. Quite possibly THE most beautiful. 138
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 08:39 PM | # Better than anything in Shakespeare, for sure. 139
Posted by PF on March 23, 2010, 08:48 PM | #
Thanks Fred! It must have been all that rap and hip-hop I listened to as a youngster! Its given me an ill lyrical flow, thats for sure! 140
Posted by Al Ross on March 23, 2010, 09:06 PM | # GW, it’s as well to remember the origins of the conflict in which both our families played a part : http://www.wintersonnenwende.com/scriptorium/english/archives/articles/jdecwar.html 141
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 09:42 PM | # ”It’s given me an ill lyrical flow, thats for sure!” (—PF) An illyrical flow — let’s see …. that’s the same as a modern-day Albanian (or Bosnian or Croatian) flow? 142
Posted by Gorboduc on March 23, 2010, 10:06 PM | # Dare I post this here? The poem must be getting fairly hackneyed by now – yet if it’s new to one reader, it will, I hope, justify the space it takes. Chesterton shows that England has actually been invaded by her enemies many times, and that each time our wicked rulers have welcomed them as our friends and have set them over us: and that we, to our shame, have trustingly accepted them. “. . . We did and died like lions, to keep ourselves in chains . . .” His hope was that we would eventually rise in anger and with violence, and, drawing on ancestral memory as a hidden wellspring of strength and spirit, liberate, purge and remake ourselves – that we would, in Tolkien’s words, ‘scour the Shire’. May God (or the Gods!) grant it be not now too late . . . Here is G.K Chesterton’s SMILE at us, pay us, pass us; but do not quite forget: The fine French kings came over in a flutter of flags and dames. And the face of the King’s Servants grew greater than the King : A war that we understood not came over the world and woke Our patch of glory ended ; we never heard guns again. They have given us into the hand of new unhappy lords, We hear men speaking for us of new laws strong and sweet, 143
Posted by Gorboduc on March 23, 2010, 10:23 PM | #
144
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 10:36 PM | # So Twelfth Night is set in Albania? I’ll have to go back and review my Shakespeare, I didn’t realize that. 145
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 23, 2010, 10:44 PM | # That Wiki link I gave didn’t work. Here, try this, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Praetorian_prefecture_of_Illyricum , then click in the text where it first says, “Illyricum (Roman Province)” — that should get you there. 146
Posted by PF on March 24, 2010, 12:16 AM | # That poem was interesting, Gorboduc. A whole theory of history in there, not at all badly rhymed either. hmmm….. 147
Posted by Grimoire on March 24, 2010, 02:20 AM | # @GW The British people, however, fought Germans because they saw a goose-stepping, militarised monstrosity which they couldn’t possible respect, and which they refused to fear, bouncing around the place and pursuing its dreams of vainglory through violence, threats and bullying. This is has some truth, yet doesn’t support the argument. The contemporary British were aware that Germany was recovering historic parts of the Reich, those lands with an overwhelming majority of ethnic Germans, who were subject to oppression, massacre and systematic genocide, on territory that was indisputably German for millennia…arrayed against tottering synthetic entities invented wholescale by Versailles, whose only purpose was dismemberment of the German Reich. All initial aggressive moves of Germany, were mobilizations on what any sensible person would describe as within historic German frontiers. As to the ‘militarized monstrosity’, the contemporary British were aware the Wehrmacht was equal in manpower, yet less well equipped than the BEF, had far less in manpower and quality/quantity in equipment than the French Grande Armée. Compared to the combined might of the BEF, the Grande Armée, the Polish and Belgium forces, ect. the Wehrmacht was a gnat. “War is coming, and a segment of British Foreign Office are active participants in steering this runaway carriage off the cliff, well before Chamberlain attempted to place the guard rails alongside the track….” These words are from an International American newspaper of the time, the Intl. Herald Tribune I think, of which I have not looked for a link, however I’m sure many of you have read it and someone can find it. There are further comments and impressions with more detail attributable to the Canadiene Prime Minister M.King. I’m sure someone knows where that is if it’s on the net. . The peaceful British astonished by the militarized monstrosity is an inversion of history. For although it may be true the patriotic Brit abhorred the thought of yet another war…. the British Foreign Office worked assiduously towards this end. Deny not the British Foreign policy of ‘balance of power’ was to encourage war on the continent by funding those powers most likely to start a war against any entity perceived as a potential threat…and then to switch sides according to what may reveal itself as most advantageous. This is British history #101, which you can read from British history books. In this argument, which I do not regard important, yet nonetheless the truth of which may be significant, by it’s omission, I must throw my support to CC and Fred Scrooby and etc. I would ignore the normal exchanges as amusing reading, for I do not see it as reasonable to blame the British for a delusion of which the guilt goes all around…but I need stress here it is time you British take off the sheep’s clothing - it is a gossamer shroud, transparent and tattered - you must come to terms that the wolf has been sighted some time ago. No one denies the worth and achievements of the British, nor the grandeur of the Empire, nor their moral fibre and immutable strength, nor the glory of their history, their islands and culture. Nor the gifts of sensibility and rigour they bequeathed to the world at large. But evidence of moral superiority is questionable, not over the NSP nor Germany of the period, taking into account the time and circumstance. Taking this into account,what you are beginning to experience on your islands is not even a fraction of what the Germans have experienced. Like Britain, Germany is more than a state or a nation, it is a sacred land….we call it the Fatherland, rightly. You may feel otherwise, but it is also your ancestral land, along with Britain, the same for many European Americans. The point of the above, is not to assign blame - European history has always been like this - the point is the measurement of your moral superiority against the rest of Europe. I feel you are not being fair to them, nor yourself. But then again I do not believe Britain or any European people will survive into the future without co-commitment. @Gorboduc @Fred Scrooby 148
Posted by Gorboduc on March 24, 2010, 05:59 AM | # @Grimoire, PF. I use the phrase “common purpose” deliberately: what’s needed is a sort of symmetrical opposite of the well-known anti-white quasi-secret society that goes by that name, something that can oppose and cancel its moves. 149
Posted by Wandrin on March 24, 2010, 04:20 PM | # Any non-US white rabbit tribe that attempted to completely reverse the migration-genocide in their country would get the same treatment as the Serbs. Even if the US situation is terminal the time it would take before the US was weakened to the point it was no threat to a successful Euro-nationalist party is longer than the time it will take for the situation in Europe to become hopeless. Therefore America can’t be ignored. What needs to happen is a moderate (on the surface) nationalist party needs to win power in at least one country and while domestically staying within the limits of what would get them bombed (e.g complete halt to immigration, deport illegals etc but nothing that could be made to look too extreme) their main effort would go into satellite TV, radio, funding and support of other nationalist parties and groups in other countries especially the US. Any country trying to go for it alone will get bombed into submission. Strength in numbers next time.
The enemy conduct psychological warfare against little anglo rabbits by guilt-tripping them over empire and slavery - however they are allowed an escape route from the psychological pressure of being the bad guys all the time through being the good guys in the context of fighting the Nazi rabbits. The psychological warfare conducted against little kraut rabbits revolves around them being mean Nazis. They don’t have an allowed escape route. When you combine these two things you get a pretty good divide and rule effect. There needs to be some kind of 50/50 compromise. 150
Posted by Desmond Jones on March 24, 2010, 05:40 PM | #
Clearly the British, unlike Americans, were Germanophobes.
They held a deep visceral hatred of the “war-like” Germans, regardless of their marching techniques. 151
Posted by Dan Dare on March 24, 2010, 08:12 PM | # Here’s one for the Starship Troopers on their Nintendos: 2012: EU signs economic and mutual assistance pact with Arab League 2014: Moratorium on external migration into EU. 2015: EU raises its common external tariff on manufactured goods to 35% 2015: Russia and Ukraine apply for EU membership; accession to be completed by 2020 2020: Common Agricultural Policy phased out and replaced by Common Defence Policy. Defence budget of expanded EU set at 3% of GDP. 2021: EU first-strike nuclear capability on par with US
152
Posted by Guessedworker on March 24, 2010, 08:17 PM | # Grimoire, I know British history quite well. But, more to the point, I know the war generation. I was born in 1951 into a large extended and working-class family, and drank from their cup. My characterisation of their attitudes to Germans and Germany comes out of the sympathy I have for them. It is not based on the arithmetic certainties of Desmond’s interesting find - don’t know how you do it, Desmond - but is, in its way, truer than that. British government policy is quite another matter, of course. I was not commenting on that but on CC’s characterisation of the Anglo-American “smashers” of Germany. Nor, as should be completely obvious, was I expressing my personal opinion of Germans and Germany - what CC insists on calling kraut-hatred, but that’s just him. I have no revulsion for NSDAP, though along with virtually all of us here I expect I would have got myself shot. I don’t like uniformity. I don’t like following. I don’t like dictat. I don’t like theatre in politics. I don’t like gangsterism in politics. I don’t like palingeneticism, which is bad psychology, basically - a pouring of petrol on green wood in the expectation of lighting a thousand year blaze. I like the idea of the permanence of human truth, if you really want to know. 153
Posted by Dan Dare on March 24, 2010, 08:24 PM | #
I wonder to what extent that might have been a function of the two countries dramatically different experiences of the First World War? 154
Posted by Grimoire on March 25, 2010, 12:48 AM | # @Gorboduc I shall get that book. At the moment I am reading ‘Odd John” which is unexpectedly about the same thing. This idea of superior or evolved humans being born among us before their time.., provoking. I’m curious to find out what Olaf Stapledon is suggesting with this theme. I’m keen on this type of imaginative, extraordinary fiction. Thank you again. Perhaps it would be a good subject for an article by yourself. When I read the two books we could compare notes as to the meaning of what he is saying.
155
Posted by Guessedworker on March 25, 2010, 08:00 AM | # Grimoire,
Sorry, I didn’t explain adequately. My characterisation was of the British war generation’s characterisation of Germany and Germans. It’s my “feel” for what they would have thought and said in the late 1930s and in the war years. I was responding to CC’s very characteristic scolding of “the Anglo-American etc, etc”, meaning people who aren’t Germans. Or National Socialists. I am not alone in finding this attitude of CC’s somewhat self-imprisoning, and I want to release him.
I could quibble about that, as you could. But let’s go with it.
I don’t think there is any internal connection between respecting an idea which commands wide support and tolerating opposing opinions. In any case, palingeneticism, dominant though it is intellectually, is not that idea. The European peoples’ survival, our continuity, our genetic interest, is. Palingeneticism does not command wide support based on its own intellectual merit but by default. There has never been a viable expression of non-paligenetic racial nationalism. 19th century German Volkishness, like British Conservatism, never developed a philosophy, only practic. To press outward into the wider world, and to truly oppose the liberal milieu, an emergent philosophy of an ontological character will first have to succeed to the position of the dominant idea within nationalism. It must persuade by its merits, of course, and not divide - in that you are entirely correct.
I would argue that holding to our cause, as described above, and expressing a philosophy founded in ontology are, ultimately, the same thing. The cause of greatness as expressed in palingeneticism is, as PF has detailed here recently, only an escape into a stirring image of Self. It is untrue and will always be found out by Time. Only being is true, and only being is permanent. I will post something over the next few days about “the muddle we face in defining it”. 156
Posted by the Narrator... on March 25, 2010, 02:21 PM | # The dividing line here seems to be that one side views WWII as a significant historical event while the other side views it as the most significant event in the history of Western Civilization. The English defense of their own is certainly admirable. But I think (in the context of our present situation) the rest of us are looking at the outcome of WWII as the central event of our (English, American, French and so on) collective history. For us, it wasn’t Germany that lost then but Western Civilization. From this perspective, WE (The West) were defeated in 1945. I, like most, had grandfathers and great-uncles who fought, were injured and even died fighting during WWII, believing they were fighting for a just and noble cause. They were wrong.
There are certainly still English and still Americans and still French and so forth and in that since those nations (ethnic groups) still exist, but everything that they were for a thousand years is no more, and has been no more since 1945. Yes, our problems were around before then, but that’s all they were, problems. 1945 is the dividing line of history. And it always will be.
Truth be told it will most likely take a Tyrant-King or two to extradite us from our current predicament. And that will be a centuries long endeavor. Such is our situation that from where we are now, our fight for survival will not end in a celebratory toast at a nearby pub. Our civilization is in ruins. ... 157
Posted by seret on March 26, 2010, 07:01 AM | # “I don’t like uniformity.” LOL. “I am not alone in finding this attitude of CC’s somewhat self-imprisoning…” Whew. Allied to people with a uniform opinion. “...and I want to release him.” From Christianity to psychoanalysis to GW, an unbroken line of mock-moral righteousness and transcendence into the world of truth. “I was born in 1951 into a large extended and working-class family, and drank from their cup. My characterisation of their attitudes to Germans and Germany comes out of the sympathy I have for them.” “My characterisation was of the British war generation’s characterisation of Germany and Germans. It’s my “feel” for what they would have thought and said in the late 1930s and in the war years. “ GW is able to choose which agit-prop believing generation he empathizes with, simply because he’s of that particular generation, or at least proximate to it. He should have no problem, then, understanding why the current English youth find him to be a detestable old man. Per his own morality, they’re correct. 158
Posted by Fred Scrooby on March 26, 2010, 08:29 AM | # “He should have no problem, then, understanding why the current English youth find him to be a detestable old man.” (—“Secret”) The current English youth know about GW? You sound as if you have a direct line into current English youth, Secret — are you one? Whom do you and your fellows look up to then? By the way, GW’s main message to “the current English youth” and all other white-race youth on the planet is their race is dwindling away and that will continue until — once they assume their role as adults in a few years’ time — they wake up and start doing certain things to halt and reverse it, things that are essentially very simple as well as totally humane and moral. What do “current English youth” think of that? 159
Posted by Desmond Jones on March 26, 2010, 05:47 PM | #
If you believe the results of the first poll, it doesn’t wash. 90% of the British stated it was the evil Nahzis…then when the shit hit the fan… The results in Canada…
Holland…
Germany…
What were we fighting for…
The American view…
The British view of the war’s main causes…
160
Posted by Dasein on March 28, 2010, 05:10 PM | #
Dan, I agree that, overall, Europe is in much better shape demographically. But is England itself that much better off, in your opinion? What do you make of the reports that ~50% of births in England and Wales are now to non-Europeans (I’m thinking in particular of reports, mostly from the BNP, based on the ONS data)? If that figure’s not an exaggeration, then it seems that England is as doomed as the US, assuming the current voting-age Britons are not able to elect someone who will repatriate these people. I would like to think the situation in England isn’t as grim as that, but I wonder how much longer the window is open for a democratic solution. You seem to have a good command of these statistics, so I’d be interested to hear your take on it. 161
Posted by Dan Dare on March 28, 2010, 06:20 PM | # Dasein I don’t believe it is particularly instructive to use the USA and England as comparators in such a discussion, a more meaningful comparison would be the the USA and the EU. But as far as a comparison between the US and English demographic situations are concerned, it has been the case that England has lagged a couple of generations behind the US. The 2011 UK census, for example, is likely to confirm that non-Europeans form a similar proportion of the population as in the US in 1960 (around 11-12%). Similarly, David Coleman’s ‘Third Demographic Transition’, which is probably the most reliable academic analysis currently available, indicates that the non-white population in the UK will increase to around 24% by 2051, assuming net migration continues at the same rate as at present. That 24% may be compared to the 2000 US census which officially put the non-white population at 25% of the total. So while the situation in the UK is dire, it is not yet terminal, and I believe that political pressure will come to bear at both the national and supranational (ie EU) level to prevent the direst prognostications from coming to pass. At the European level the non-white population is still quite small, around 5% of the total. It would take unprecedentedly massive non-white immigration (15-20 million annually) for a generation or more for Europe’s non-white population to reach 25%. That is simply not going to happen. This is not a presenting a case for complacency but rather an attempt to highlight that while the threat is real there is still time to avert it at the European level, which is really what counts. It is perfectly legitimate for the BNP and others to generate apocalyptic scenarios as a conscious-raising exercise but they have to be prepared for the statistical basis for their prognostications to be challenged. Next entry: The Gorge-ous Day Is Nearly Upon Us Previous entry: Automatic for the Sheeple |
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Posted by Guessedworker on March 19, 2010, 08:57 PM | #
I saw that story this evening too. The Times staff will have enjoyed that. The one-liners must have been flying.
“If today I stand here as a Silly Mid On, it is as a Silly Mid On against the sillyness of standing here.”
“Who says I am not under the special protection of God.”
... and so forth.