Illegality may be a good way to filter immigrants

Posted by John S Bolton on December 09, 2005, 08:22 PM | #

In that case, how to explain that California public schools’ performance has gone from the top tenth of states’, to the bottom tenth or lower, in only forty years? How can their median personal incomes be only half that of the majority? When Italians came here in large numbers, they did not start out below the national average appreciably, given that the cities they moved to, were often quite far above the national average income. Today’s concentratin of latino immigrants in the most expensive cities, means that their incomes per person, in terms of local costs, are even further below standard than is conveyed in the data with national medians.

Posted by Fred Scrooby on December 09, 2005, 10:21 PM | #

“as a social scientist, I look at the process overall and conclude that the USA is probably not worse off genetically for its Hispanic influx.  There are a lot of good genes coming across the border too.”  (—from the log entry)

That’s great, John; great to know.  We’ll defo keep that in mind—next time we want to change our genotype from white to Hispanic that’ll come in damned handy.  Once we do decide to take the plunge and actually change our race to Hispanic, it goes without saying we’ll want only the better sort of Hispanic genes from south of the border to replace our white ones with, so this log entry is a real plus in that regard:  it’ll help show us the way.  Of course it doesn’t explain why we have to change our race.  It doesn’t tell us why we can’t just stick with our own white versions of all those good genes, instead of switching to the Hispanic versions.  But ours is not to reason why, John, and we realize highly-educated people like you know what’s in our best interest.  It is therefore with eager anticipation that we await the day when we’ll have shed the last of our whiteness and emerged in our new identity as non-white Hispanics, with, needless to say, only the very best genes the Hispanic race has to offer incorporated into our genotypes!—not for an instant would we consider accepting anything less than the Hispanic best! 

“the [Hispanic] guy that I used to get breakfast off in NYC [...] was a splendid example of capitalistic incentives at work and also a splendid example of the sort of immigrant you get when you make them pass a heavy filter.”

Right, that guy’s exactly the type of Hispanic we want whites to change into.  Why we have to change races in the first place is something we’re not too clear on (why do we need to “filter” immigrants at all, instead of filling our country up with ourselves?) but we have faith our élites know what’s best and if they say we can’t continue to be white, well, that’s good enough for us.  You’d think white women would be biologically able to keep having white babies and continue to reproduce the white race as they’ve always done, but apparently that’s moved out of the realm of the possible, our leaders tell us, so yes, changing into the sort of Hispanic John used to get his breakfast off of in Manhattan is our best bet.  Thanks, John! 
______
Moratorium-plus-Repatriation!

Posted by Fred Scrooby on December 09, 2005, 11:46 PM | #

John Ray’s gone to the trouble of explaining in greater detail his motivation for posting that link.  I want to explain my view of the entire matter:  what I oppose is forced race-replacement and lots of ordinary people have, at bottom, the same concern I do but may not express it the same way because they don’t dare to (lifelong brainwashing that it’s baaaaaaaaaad to say it) or because they don’t know how to say it.  Incidentally, John, races exist on pieces of land, not on the heads of pins or in airplanes circling overhead or in Earth orbit or in parallel universes.  They exist on land.  The race and the land go together and two races can’t occupy the same parcel of land, sort of a Pauli exclusion principle for races instead of electrons.  Maybe things shouldn’t be that way—maybe that irritates you or you find it illegitimate—but that’s the way things are.  When the land is taken away from one race and given to another the first one shrivels up and eventually disappears.  What I oppose is that process being forced on traditional (sub)races and traditional collections of (sub)races making up communities and nations.  I oppose it being forced on them by detached, self-regarding, aloof élites ( ... sort of like you, John ...) or by anyone else.  Some people don’t perceive the existence of races, and I suspect, John, this is true of you.
______
—”

that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.”—Enoch Powell
—Moratorium-plus-

!
—Balkanization is better than Brazilianization!
—The

:  the gift that keeps on giving!
—What’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the usual suspects!

Posted by Mark Richardson on December 10, 2005, 12:21 AM | #

JJR, I never know how seriously to take you when you write these kind of posts.

First, you argue that illegals are assets because they have demonstrated enterprise in arriving illegally.

Second, you again base politics on epicure when you conclude that a person who cooks your breakfast efficiently is an asset to the country.

I won’t touch the immigrants as useful cooks argument. But as to the benefits of illegality, it’s interesting that even an open borders enthusiast like Peggy Noonan is now worried by the negative effects of illegality on millions of US immigrants:

http://www.amnation.com/vfr/archives/004693.html

Posted by jonjayray on December 10, 2005, 12:43 AM | #

“I won’t touch the immigrants as useful cooks argument”

I was brought up on the horrors of traditional British food —meat and 3 veg —so you’d better not!

Posted by Steve Edwards on December 10, 2005, 06:16 AM | #

As I have said many times before, there is no point trying to get any consistency out of JJR on illegal immigration, because, even as a social scientist, consistency is not John’s trade. Instead, from John, we follow this repeated process of the personal being extrapolated to the general. Thus, because John gets cooked breakfast by a Hispanic, it follows that America should become Hispanic.

There is simply no methodology here, and for good reason - John’s ideal society is Brazil. He literally pulls out a prayer mat every day and prays in the direction of Rio de Janeiro. There is absolutely no point trying to get John to provide any data to support his assertions, because for John this isn’t about data, it’s about blind emotion.

Posted by Melba Peachtoast on December 10, 2005, 11:04 AM | #

Majority Rights darlings:
    If I thought that you all thought that we Aussies were all as gung-ho for racemixing in America as my (it pains me to admit) countryman JJR then I would suffer no inconsiderable pangs of shame I am sure of it. Oh, let the dingy tide roll in, and wash away the native soil! is that what we are advocating you must be asking yourselves. (Sounds a bit like the last paragraph of Capek’s “Newts” with the soil washing away.) Anyhow, honeys, Melba’s here now to tell you it isn’t so, many of us are rooting for you like you were truffles. If this is a bit scattered, it is because I was up half the night with a bipolar wombat. Still, the station must go on!

Posted by Fred Scrooby on December 10, 2005, 11:24 AM | #

“John’s ideal society is Brazil.”  (—Steve Edwards)

In order never to lose sight of that I’m going to add it to my signature slogans.  Bertrand Russell said you can only start being happy in life once you realize and accept that men are wicked, because until you realize and fully accept that, you’re forever frustrated, shocked, disappointed, angry, outraged, and so forth.  Once you accept it you can for the first time begin to be happy because you’re no longer blindsided by it—you never expected anything else in the first place.  Likewise with John Ray:  dealing with him is a continual process of tearing your hair out by the roots in frustration, until you realize and fully accept that, as Steve reminds us there, Brazil is his ideal society.  The further race-replacement advances, the more people like me and Steve Edwards are horrified and the more people like John Ray quietly rejoice.  No that’s not an exaggeration, not some sort of hyperbole, it’s the simple truth and the sooner others who are concerned about race-replacement realize that about John the sooner they can start to get along with him. 
______
—”

that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.”—Enoch Powell
—Moratorium-plus-

!
—Balkanization is better than Brazilianization!
—John Ray’s ideal society is Brazil!
—The

:  the gift that keeps on giving!
—What’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the usual suspects!

Posted by Fred Scrooby on December 10, 2005, 11:37 AM | #

Thanks for the support, Melba.  It’s nice to know we’ve got the LGBT Australian Outback sheepstation keepers on our side!  That’s always a big plus!

Posted by Fred Scrooby on December 10, 2005, 12:31 PM | #

I hope it’s not necessary to say I wasn’t calling John Ray “wicked” in my comment above.  He’s obviously highly moral, the opposite of wicked.  I was merely saying he’ll frustrate and maybe even infuriate you until you accept that he rejoices at, not recoils from, the prospect of race-replacement.  He’s got some sort of thing for Euro-nonEuro hybridization which he apparently feels will improve things all around.  He has little or no feeling for race.  But he’s a great anti-leftist, clearly a highly moral man, and likely a wonderful person to get to know in real life.
______
—”

that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.”—Enoch Powell
—Moratorium-plus-

!
—Balkanization is better than Brazilianization!
—John Ray’s ideal society is Brazil!
—The

:  the gift that keeps on giving!
—What’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the usual suspects!

Posted by Melba Peachtoast on December 10, 2005, 04:03 PM | #

Freddy, where did you get the notion that Melba is polymorphous-perverse? I’m a bit brash and blowsy I’ll grant you but never that, I’m quite a good girl by most standards.

Posted by Svigor on December 10, 2005, 04:44 PM | #

John, your vigorous immigrants bit exactly parallels a radio program by William Pierce, the founder of the “neo-Nazi” organization National Alliance.

That guilt-by-association bit is a double-edged sword I guess.

Posted by Svigor on December 10, 2005, 04:46 PM | #

Emigration is always a selective process of some kind and the only issue is what the particular selective pressure is in any given case.  And I frankly think that the selective pressure of getting into the USA illegally is probably as good a filter as passing any of the normal bureaucratic barriers that I know of.

Sort of like when Castro emptied his jails, with a free inner tube for every inmate?

Posted by Svigor on December 10, 2005, 04:48 PM | #

Oh, and as a social scientist, how do you view the impact of regression to the mean on this discussion?

Posted by Fred Scrooby on December 10, 2005, 05:11 PM | #

“I’m a bit brash and blowsy I’ll grant you but never that, I’m quite a good girl by most standards.”

All right then, Melba, you sound sincere this time, so I’ll believe you, and I apologize for jumping to conclusions before. 

While I’m about apologizing I suppose I owe an apology to John Ray, in this sense (he’s too much of a gentleman to point this out in his own defense, so I’ll do it):  there are different arguments for opposing race-replacement, some of them purely economic which have nothing to do with just plain not wanting your nation’s traditional race (traditional collection of sub-races) changed into a different one (different ones).  For example, the other day in the comments thread underneath one of Martin’s Bear’s Lair offerings I happened to link to some of La Grifffe du Lion’s material laying out predictions of economic decline as a function of the volume of Third-World immigration permitted into a white country—La Griffe’s “Smart Fraction Theory.”  For me, “Smart Fraction Theory” is only one reason to oppose race-replacement and not the most important one (seeing my nation’s traditional race changed into something else is the most important one).  I felt it was appropriate to mention in my comment, since the Bear’s Lair piece brought up the advisability of getting the U.S.‘s immigration situation under control from a purely economic standpoint, the standpoint of the “Smart Fraction Theory” (purely economic).  The “Smart Fraction Theory” doesn’t apply to excessive Oriental immigration coming into white countries.  I oppose that on other grounds:  I don’t want my race replaced (even if the race brought in to replace it be as smart or smarter).  John comes along and legitimately posts this entry as part of the purely economic immigration debate, the only part he cares about (since he absolutely does not give a fig for Euro racial preservation):  he knows the “Smart Fraction Theory” applies to Hispanics but thinks he sees a way in which it might not fully apply—in which its effect might be “blunted,” so to speak—if you can show that instead of importing a random sampling of Hispanics you’re importing a more able, tougher, more energetic sub-set of them thanks to the pressures of the immigration experience acting as a “filter.”  He was legitimately addressing the purely economic side of the immigration question and I came along and sort of changed the subject, blasting him on race-replacement grounds—“I don’t want my race replaced”—a different side of the issue (something he of course doesn’t give a damn about but which, it must be said in his defense but he’s too polite to, he wasn’t addressing).

So I apologize to John for sort of “changing the subject” to one he wasn’t commenting on, in my criticism of his entry.  And just to show what a nice guy I am, I’m taking “John Ray’s ideal society is Brazil” out of my signature slogan even though it happens to be true, as Steve pointed out—John’s ideal society is Brazil and therefore I have every theoretical right to keep it in.  (But John had just better watch his step—it wouldn’t take much to get me to put it back in there.)
______
 
—”

that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.”—Enoch Powell
—Moratorium-plus-

!
—Balkanization is better than Brazilianization!
—The

:  the gift that keeps on giving!
—What’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the usual suspects!

Posted by Fred Scrooby on December 10, 2005, 05:15 PM | #

Svigor’s point, above, about regression to the mean is, of course, one reason John’s objection to purely economic immigration critiques isn’t valid.  There are others, including the social-services net nowadays, family chain-migration, and others.  Good point, Svigor.

Posted by Lurker (grey English!) on December 11, 2005, 12:23 AM | #

Im not American, Ive never been to the US or the southern border. But if half of what Ive heard about the border is true its hardly the brutal Spartan style section filter that JJR seems to believe.

Even now with modern communications a Brit moving to Australia is still making a major uproot from family, home & friends not to mention the financial costs of getting to Oz (and setting up there).

A Mexican might be no more than a bus ride away from the US and many once established seem to have no problem shuttling backwards and forwards across the border.

What exactly is the selection process that illegal entry to the US represents? For Mexicans illegal entry to the US rarely seems more than inconvenient. On the whole British legal (& illegal) migration to Oz seems tougher.

You can forget those tough Boers bred to survive in Africa. The future belongs to Mexicans, those tough little bastards (trying to sound Aussie there!) are genetically selected to overcome…inconvenience?

Posted by Fred Scrooby on December 11, 2005, 01:39 AM | #

Excellent points, Lurker!
______
Moratorium-plus-Repatriation!