An insightful article from a wise Irishwoman

Posted by jonjayray on Friday, 24 March 2006 05:43.

I have been reading “Freedom at Midnight,” the popular classic of 30 years ago that recounted the coming of democracy to India. The authors, journalists Larry Collins and Dominique Lapierre, capture the end of the Raj with sweep and drama, and manage to make even the dividing of India and Pakistan—I mean the literal drawing of the lines between the two countries, by a British civil servant—riveting. But the sobering lesson of this history, the big thing you bring away, is this: They didn’t know.

Mountbatten and Nehru and Jinnah were brilliant men who’d not only experienced a great deal; they’d done a great deal, and yet they did not know that the Subcontinent—which each in his own way, and sometimes it was an odd way, loved—would explode in violence, that bloodlust would rule as soon as the Union Jack was lowered.

On Aug. 15, 1947, independence day, in the Punjab, in the city of Amritsar, as local authorities performed the jolly rituals of the transfer of power, a group of local Sikhs went on a rampage in a Muslim neighborhood, killing its male inhabitants. That night, Amritsar’s railroad station became a refugee camp for thousands of Hindus who’d fled what was now Pakistan’s part of the Punjab. As trains arrived, huge crowds scanned the cars for relatives and friends, for children left behind in the flight. Suddenly a train came in but there seemed no one aboard, which was odd. The stationmaster, Chani Singh, waved the train to a halt. The teeming crowd on the platform froze into “an eerie silence.”  From the book:-

Singh stared down the line of eight carriages. All the windows of the compartments were wide open but there was not a single human being standing at any of them. . . . [He] strode to the first carriage, snatched open the door and stepped inside. In one horrible instant he understood why no one was getting off the Ten Down Express in Amritsar that night. It was a trainful of corpses. The floor of the compartment before him was a tangled jumble of human bodies, throats cut, skulls smashed, bowels eviscerated. Arms, legs, trunks of bodies were strewn along the corridors of compartments.

He heard a strangled sound and called out, “You are in Amritsar. We are Hindus and Sikhs here. The police are present. Do not be afraid.”  “At his words a few of the dead began to stir. The stark horror of the scenes that followed would be for ever a nightmare engraved upon the station master’s mind.” A woman shrieked as she held her husband’s severed head. Children began to weep as they held the bodies of their slaughtered mothers.  “In every compartment in every carriage the sight was the same.” On the last car he saw, written in whitewash, “the assassins’ calling card. ‘This train is our Independence gift to Nehru and Patel,’ it read.”

The savagery spread, and turned the Subcontinent into a charnel house. In the end hundreds of thousands were dead.  And yet Lord Louis Mountbatten, the last viceroy of India; Jawaharlal Nehru, one of India’s founding fathers, and its first prime minister; and Muhammad Ali Jinnah, head of the Muslim League and first governor-general of Pakistan, and many other leaders in the movement for independence—most of them—were shocked and horrified by the scale and bloodiness of the fighting.  How could this be?

One can infer a great deal from the book. Everyone in a position of authority seems to have been blinded, in part, by the Mission.  The tough, preternaturally self-confident Mountbatten had been sent by London to oversee independence, and he was bloody well going to do it. He was Mountbatten of Burma after all, and he’d first toured India with his cousin David, the future Edward VIII. Imperialism was over, Mountbatten was given his charge: get Britain out with grace and dignity, part as friends, preserve the special ties between London and Delhi. For Mountbatten, speed was everything. He thought the sectarian violence that had begun to crop up as independence neared would be quelled by the transfer of power and partition.

For Nehru, the mission was to secure a free and democratic India. Only then would he realize his personal destiny, to become its first prime minister and impose upon its masses the Fabian socialism that had so impressed him when, as a young Indian outsider at Cambridge, he was dazzled by London’s salons. (Those salons damaged him more than any British prison ever did.)

Jinnah sought to create the world’s biggest Muslim nation, with him as head. On the day of independence, Pakistan was littered not by little flags but by pictures of one man: him. He ate bacon with his eggs, liked whiskey at night, and seems never to have had a personal religious impulse he could not squelch. But he too had a destiny, and if the Subcontinent had to be rent for him to achieve it, then so be it.

So they were all driven by their mission. And by personal ambition, which tends to narrow one’s focus, or rather train one’s focus on oneself, and away from more important things.  And there was something else.

The leaders of the day did not know that terrible violence was coming because of what I think is a classic and structural problem of leadership: It distances. Each of these men was to varying degrees detached from facts on the ground. They were by virtue of their position and accomplishments an elite. They no longer knew what was beating within the hearts of those who lived quite literally on the ground. Nehru, Mountbatten, Jinnah—they well knew that Muslims feared living under the rule of the Hindus, that Hindus feared living under Muslims, that Sikhs feared both. But the leaders did not know the fear that was felt was so deep, so constitutional, so passionate. They did not know it would find its expression in a savagery so wild and widespread.

Each of these leaders had been removed by his own history from facts on the ground. “Elitism” doesn’t always speak of where you went to school or what caste, as it were, you came from. You can wind up one of the elites simply by rising. Simply by being separated for a certain amount of time from those you seek to lead.

People who know most intimately, and through most recent experience, what is happening on the ground, and in the hearts of men, are usually not in the inner councils. They have not fought their way or earned their way in yet. Sometimes they’re called in and listened to, at least for a moment, but in the end they tend to be ignored. They’re nobodies, after all.

This is a problem with government and governing bodies—with the White House, Downing Street, with State Department specialists, and the Council on Foreign Relations, and West Point, too. It is not so much a matter of fault as it is structural. The minute you rise to govern you become another step removed from the lives of those you govern. Which means you become removed from reality ...

The only one who knew what was coming was Gandhi, mystic, genius and eccentric, who drove the other great men crazy by insisting on living among and ministering to the poor, the nonelite. He knew their hearts. He had given his life for a free and independent India but opposed partition and feared the immediate chaos it would bring. He spent the eve of Independence mourning. Six months later he was dead.

http://www.opinionjournal.com/columnists/pnoonan/?id=110008126

Tags: History



Comments:


1

Posted by Phil Peterson on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 07:50 | #

Moral of the story: don’t import those problems here.


2

Posted by karlmagnus on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 10:23 | #

Far too favorable to the appalling corrupt Commie-sympathiser Mountbatten, whose wife was bonking Nehru. All parties to Indian independence except Jinnah were deeply evil left wingers, and the sectarian violence was a result of this. 

The Congress party had no legitimacy whatever; it was a bunch of British-educated marxists who in an earlier better age would have been interned, not allowed to get their sticky fingers on government.  Britsih Imperial rule became appallingly limp-wristed and left-enhancing once Curzon left.

By 1947, given Britain’s appalling economic position, Indian independence was probably inevitable, but it should have been split up into small pieces with only the loosest confederal structure if any, and as much as possible of it given back to the traditional Maharajah rulers. At all costs, democracy should have been avoided. 

That way, Bengal would have become a Commie slum, and most of the rest of India would have Emerged 50 years earlier, and become reliable British allies and business partners, and useful counterparts to leftist nonsense in the Commonwealth and the UN. This may happen now, if the Congress Party can finally be prised from power, but it could have happened 50 years ago.


3

Posted by Phil Peterson on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 11:22 | #

Far too favorable to the appalling corrupt Commie-sympathiser Mountbatten, whose wife was bonking Nehru.

I also heard Nehru was in bed both husband and wife at different points of time (he was bi-sexual apparently).


4

Posted by Phil Peterson on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 11:24 | #

was in bed both husband and wife

Lord and Lady Mountbatten, that is.


5

Posted by karlmagnus on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 12:23 | #

The latest (post-Wilson) views that I’ve seen are that Mountbatten was indeed gay rather than bisexual but racist and fitness-ist, thus having little interest in the scrawny intellectual Nehru.  Edwina on the other hand went for anything with the right equipment attached.

Mountbatten’s real reason for haste in India, BTW, was not any worry about massacres of Indians (about which he appears not to have cared a hoot) but the need to get back to Britain in time for Princess Elizabeth’s wedding to his nephew Philip.


6

Posted by Phil Peterson on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 12:55 | #

The latest (post-Wilson) views that I’ve seen are that Mountbatten was indeed gay rather than bisexual but racist and fitness-ist

Mountbatten was racist?


7

Posted by Phil Peterson on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 13:07 | #

Edwina on the other hand went for anything with the right equipment attached.

A woman stuck with a Fag for a husband will eventually seek extra-marital sex. There’s nothing surprising in any of that.

In some ways, the end of the “closet” has been a boon for women because it ensures that aren’t stuck in dead-end marriages with buggers.


8

Posted by Søren Renner on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 15:22 | #

Mountbottom. Now that’s funny.


9

Posted by Mark Richardson on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 18:41 | #

Fred, wholehearted agreement. The IRA falls into the category of the despicable. A group which conducted a murderous terror campaign, but are now happy for the Irish to be race replaced.

It won’t be long before the remnant Irish will curse them as traitors.


10

Posted by Laban on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 18:44 | #

I’m not sure it was because they were members of an elite that they didn’t get it. Here’s a chap who was from the elite who understood.

“As the British authority passes ... the old hatreds between Moslem and Hindu revive and acquire new life and malignancy. We cannot easily conceive what these hatreds are. There are in India mobs of neighbours, people who have lived all their lives in the closest propinquity, who when held and dominated by their passions will tear each other to pieces - men, women and children - with their bare hands.”

Winston Churchill, House of Commons, 1931.


11

Posted by Phil Peterson on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 19:12 | #

Laban,

Winston Churchill is a pretty stiff standard to expect anyone to live up to.


12

Posted by starimomak on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 19:54 | #

  They who tried to destroy the U.K. are now, incidentally, trying to destroy their own country, Ireland, by kneecapping (or whatever it is they do) any Irishman who questions race-replacement there.

I’ve seen this on this site a couple of times now. Where’s the evidence—I have not seen one thing that shows the IRA is pro-immigration. Willing to be proved wrong, though.

As it is, I think the situation is horrible. I remember being at an academic conference in 2001. A speaker from the six counties noted there were now more Madarin chinese in NI than Gaelic speakers. The grey ponytailed hippy that was chairing the panel broke into a hideous smile at that. Ghastly, as you Brits would say.

Meandering a bit, but I do really think that a lot of you English right-wingers are too chauvanistic against the Celtic peoples. The BNP has it right—a confederation of indigeneous nations. Its no acident that some academics are now trying to pose a multi-racial, multicultural ‘English’ nationalism against the narrow, almost ‘racist’ Celtic ones. English nationists have to embrace their counterparts West of Offa’s dyke and north of the border. And get those idiot protestants to agree to the integrity of Ireland.


13

Posted by benny on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 20:55 | #

BTW Mountbottom was Jewish

“(1) was established before the partly Jewish Battenbergs (who changed their name to Mountbatten) married into the Royal Family.”

from THE KOSHER KINGS
by Professor Revilo P. Oliver


14

Posted by Benny on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 20:59 | #

Also this

Lastly, note that there were a number of European Jews who lived, or settled in India. Some examples: Lady Mountbatten, and Haffkine, after   whom the famous Haffkine Institute in Bombay (Mumbai) has been named.
  The mother of one of India’s most glamorous film actresses, Zeenat Aman is said to be Jewish.


from: http://www.faqs.org/faqs/judaism/FAQ/07-Jews-As-Nation/section-10.html


15

Posted by Matra on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 21:43 | #

starimomak, the only region of the UK that has shown much support for Ulster Protestants has been Scotland - Celtic last I checked. Even that support hasn’t been great and has mostly been limited to the southwest. In the early 90s about £100,000 a year went from Scottish fundraisers to Ulster loyalist paramilitaries - or terrorists as most would say. The thousands of Scots who travel to Belfast for the Twelfth each year often get the biggest cheers during the parades but they are not representative of most Scots.

In England support has been limited to statements by right wing Tories and “extreme” nationalist groups like BNP and National Front, though some English neo-Nazis like Combat 18 have ties to Protestant paramilitaries.

Here’s an article about recent UVF (the loyalist Ulster Volunteer Force) attacks on immigrants in Protestant parts of Belfast.

When such attacks occur Sinn Fein representatives are usually all over the local nightly news condemning all racism and bragging about their commitment to equality and tolerance. Sinn Fein has been trying to recruit from immigrant communities, especially in the Republic where their councillors are often prominent supporters of illegals.

But they have to be careful as the average working class Irish Republican is no bleeding heart. He may have cheered on Martin Luther King and Nelson Mandela from a distance but it remains to be seen how he will react when his own neighbourhood gets invaded.  It seems to be just the Sinn Fein activists and elite who are pushing the anti-racism agenda.


16

Posted by Mark Richardson on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 22:34 | #

Starimomak, Sinn Fein are absolutely hopeless on the immigration issue.

Here is a quote from their official manifesto for the 2001 Westminster elections:

Anti-Racism

As Ireland becomes a more multicultural country, the challenge is to embrace our growing diversity as a source of strength and opportunity. To do this we must begin by opposing racism, discrimination and intolerance of any kind, wherever it occurs.

All of this requires a multi-faceted response: politically, educationally and working with communities and on an all-Ireland basis. Sinn Féin welcomes the Directive by the European Council in June 2000 requiring enhancement of the anti-racist provisions of EU member states by 2003.

Sinn Féin calls on all political parties in Ireland to sign an anti-racist pledge and make a commitment that they will not play party politics with the race issue and that they will not tolerate racism in any form in their party.

Asylum seekers and refugees

• All asylum seekers who arrived in Ireland before January 1st 2001 should be granted an amnesty;

• Measures to combat racism in Ireland through policies such as incitement to hatred legislation, racial discrimination; mainstreaming anti-racist awareness and resourcing minority ethnic groups and projects;

• A National Task Force on Immigration and Emigration to develop a national policy and a new Immigration Act;

• An end to detention of asylum seekers — 15 per cent of asylum seekers in the Six Counties are detained each year;

• An end to the use of voucher systems for asylum-seekers;

• Amendments to the Dublin Convention to make special provision for the experience of asylum seekers and expedite their release from custody if they have claimed refugee status in the 26 Counties and are then arrested as illegal entrants in the Six Counties;

• The Equality Commission to demonstrate the robustness of Section 75 of the Northern Ireland Act to correct existing inequalities between people, irrespective of race or ethnic origin.


17

Posted by karlmagnus on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 22:48 | #

I’d forgotten that this group likes to find sinister jewish influences or I’d have covered them in my post. Moutntbatten was zero percent Jewish as far as can be ascertained; he was a great grandson of Queen Victoria, with his other ancestors being German royalty-aristocracy, who didn’t marry Jews if they could avoid it.  Edwina however was at least half Jewish; her grandfather was the financier Sir Ernest Cassel, who was German Jewish. So Enjoy, conspiracy theorists!


18

Posted by Lurker on Fri, 24 Mar 2006 23:12 | #

I would suspect SF as being just the sort of group to encourage immigrants, the “elect a new people” routine as a way of bluring unionist identity - and Irish identity (to save the village it was neccesary to destroy it).

starimomak - those pesky protestants, suffering from false consciousness, when will they learn eh?!

Im always on about this, I think the safe option would be for careful repartition plus plenty of bribes for population transfers. If it had started 30 years ago the problem would have been solved by now. resulting in a smaller but wholly protestant NI. I think that SF/IRA would fade away quite rapidly once that was done.


19

Posted by Phil Peterson on Sat, 25 Mar 2006 06:14 | #

I’d forgotten that this group likes to find sinister jewish influences

“This group”, Martin?

One commenter makes a ridiculous assertion about Mountbatten being Jewish and everyone else gets tarred with the same brush.


20

Posted by Matra on Sat, 25 Mar 2006 16:06 | #

Lurker - It may not be too late for re-partition. With most Prods now living in the north east and RCs dominating the west and south (in part thanks to systematic ethnic cleansing) it could be a solution if serious hostilities were to resume.


21

Posted by Matra on Sat, 25 Mar 2006 16:30 | #

In addition to Mark Richardson’s post above here are quotes from the Sinn Fein website:

Asylum seekers are people who come to Ireland seeking refugee status because of persecution and oppression; if they are successful, they become recognised as refugees.

There can be no limit on the number of asylum seekers under the UN Convention on the Status of Refugees and its 1967 Protocol because of internationally-agreed human rights protections and standards. No political party is advocating withdrawal from the Convention, so anyone who makes political capital out of a desire to limit numbers of refugees is advocating a violation of human rights.

Therefore policy on asylum seekers and refugees is primarily about their treatment, not their right to exist or their numbers…

Sinn Féin recognises the specific responsibility of Ireland and Irish people to defend and extend the rights of asylum seekers and refugees. Irish people, as a direct consequence of their own experience of colonialism and human rights abuses, have an empathy with other people in similar situations. Millions of Irish people were forced to leave Ireland - some as refugees, some as what would now be called ‘economic migrants’ and ‘illegal immigrants’ - to find asylum and hope in other countries such as the USA and Australia. We cannot ignore the legacy of this history and the specific obligation it places us under to contemporary asylum seekers and refugees…

All asylum seekers who arrived in Ireland before January 1st 2001 should be granted an amnesty.

No Sinn Fein document would be complete without an attack on British bigotry:

Sinn Féin’s resolute opposition to racism is in the context of the experience by many Irish people of anti-Irish racism. Sinn Féin will campaign vigorously to encourage the Irish Government, and other governments - especially the British Government - to assume their responsibilities for addressing continuing anti-Irish racism in Britain.

Anyone seen the film The Commitments? A character in it says “the Irish are the blacks of Europe”. Spend enough time reading Irish nationalist literature and you’ll realise that’s how they see themselves. Another favourite goes something like this: “we Irish are the only Europeans to be colonised by another European country therefore we identify more with the exploited Third World”.


22

Posted by Lurker on Sat, 25 Mar 2006 17:23 | #

we Irish are the only Europeans to be colonised by another European country - I’d not heard that before, never mind that’s even true.


23

Posted by Guessedworker on Sat, 25 Mar 2006 18:03 | #

Sinn Fein to re-brand for modern Ireland ...

S’pose we call ourselves, “Us ‘n the asylum seekers alone.”  No, that’s not right.  Too windy.  Hmm, ah ... “Alone with them asylum seekers.”  Nope, the Army Council won’t go for that in a million years.  OK, how about, “Asylum r us.  Er, alone.”  Jaysus, why did Mart’n give me this job?  Well, what about, “Usylam ... lone, lum, lum.”  Ah crap, I’m gonna go out ‘n shoot somebody.  Aghh double crap.  They cut me fockin gun in two.


24

Posted by starimomak on Sat, 25 Mar 2006 22:06 | #

No question this is silly policy on the part of the IRA. But a word to the wise…your English nationalism is being used, as we are sitting in front of our little screens, as the civic and/or multicultural model to fight the celtic nationalism. You guys are going to left cheering for 10 Africans wearing the cross of St. George in the next world cup.

Meanwhile the English flee to Wales, rural France, Spain, anywhere to get out of the pit they have created.


25

Posted by Lurker on Sat, 25 Mar 2006 22:39 | #

British nationalism used to be able to accomodate a certain amout of English & Celtic nationalism. No-one forsaw how it was going to turned into something else.


26

Posted by Phil Peterson on Sun, 26 Mar 2006 05:41 | #

Sinn Fein/IRA = scum.


27

Posted by karlmagnus on Sun, 26 Mar 2006 12:42 | #

Now this is MUCH better. Nice anti-Irish diatribes instead of anti-Jewish ones.  Of course, my second wife was Irish…..


28

Posted by Phil Peterson on Sun, 26 Mar 2006 13:52 | #

Martin,

Did you NEVER fall in love with any English girls? (chuckle)


29

Posted by Phil Peterson on Sun, 26 Mar 2006 13:54 | #

Now this is MUCH better. Nice anti-Irish diatribes instead of anti-Jewish ones.

I said the IRA are scum (which they are). That’s not a diatribe against the Irish.


30

Posted by karlmagnus on Sun, 26 Mar 2006 16:01 | #

Phil, they never fell in love with me.  More sense!


31

Posted by Phil Peterson on Sun, 26 Mar 2006 16:30 | #

Phil, they never fell in love with me.  More sense!

LOL! That doesn’t sound right, Martin.


32

Posted by Calvin on Sun, 26 Mar 2006 19:03 | #

“Europe will only be able to maintain its prosperity and generous social system if it succeeds in generating a growth rate of 4 to 5% over the next couple of decades”

Population decrease would create full employment, high wages, a decreased burden on the NHS and a reduction in spending on education. All of which would vastly reduce the cost of our “generous social system”.

“The Irish economy has been booming at an annual growth rate of over 5.6% for over 20 years now. In barely 18 years Ireland has made the unbelievable jump from the 22nd to the 4th place in the OECD prosperity ranking”

Ireland’s economic growth is unsustainable. Ireland is Europe’s economic “late bloomer”, standards of living have simply risen to European norms over the last few decades. This is largely the result of long dormant economic potential finally being realised not immigrant labour.

“the Irish tax model provides a positive stimulus to participation, saving, investment and enterprise: the crucial factors which the rest of Europe lacks”

Their “fair tax structure” wont matter a rat’s ass when the economic boom ends. The Kalahari Bushmen have the most equal tax system in the world, no one pays any tax, the last time I looked they were on the brink of extinction.

If having an abundance of cheap labour creates strong economies why are all the countries with vast labour forces economic basket cases? Cheap labour creates peasant economies. The Irish only just stopped being peasants back in the eighties.


33

Posted by Al Ross on Sun, 26 Mar 2006 21:01 | #

Noonan mentions Gandhi towards the end of her piece but doesnt make the obvious point that the Indian leader’s London barrister-style rhetoric combined with his faux-sanyasi
mode of living only worked on the soft-hearted Brits. Had the Japanese conquered India, the little fakir’s head would have been rolling through the dust.


34

Posted by Lurker on Sun, 26 Mar 2006 21:25 | #

Ireland has been the recipient of net inflows of cash from the EU for several years. Topping up unemployment benefit for one I believe. Building roads, bridges, public works etc. Certainly takes the strain off the Irish taxpayer. I pointed this out to a libertarian a year or two ago, he stated that none of this affected the economy (ie all this growth is “real”) as the market automatically discounts these cash flows.

Not being a libertarian Im too stupid to understand why EU payment for Irish infrastructure doesnt just cause inflation…


35

Posted by karlmagnus on Sun, 26 Mar 2006 22:51 | #

As every French finance minister knows, Ireland has achieved growth by “tax aggression”—having a corporation tax of 12 1/2%, far lower than any other EU country.  They discovered this in the late 80s, when they set up the zero tax “Shannon license” system, which attracted some excitingly dodgy aircraft leasing operations, so they extended it to the whole country.

Their method only works when you have a more or less open market of 300 million which doesn’t tax centrally and companies can choose which bit of it to set up in—if Australia set a very low corporation tax rate it would get only a modest benefit, because being in Australia doesn’t get you free access to anywhere else.

Puerto Rico did the same thing with the US in the 60s and 70s with their Section 931 zero tax companies. However, Puerto Rico was too dozy to realize that, for this to work properly, they needed to be a full state of the US (while keeping the zero tax—a Dem congress would have let them do this, because of the votes), and not keep having independence riots.

Well done, the gallant little paddies, but it doesn’t make them geniuses.

Wife #2 was actually Irish-American, and only about 70% Irish by ancestry. Bloody woman used to accuse me of having anti-Irish prejudice. Me!


36

Posted by Steve Edwards on Mon, 27 Mar 2006 02:11 | #

Those Feiners are some nationalists, eh? I bet the same is true of the Scottish “nationalists”.


37

Posted by Phil Peterson on Mon, 27 Mar 2006 02:43 | #

Bloody woman used to accuse me of having anti-Irish prejudice. Me!

LOL!


38

Posted by Phil Peterson on Mon, 27 Mar 2006 02:44 | #

Martin,

How did you manage to remain solvent after all those divorces?


39

Posted by Phil Peterson on Mon, 27 Mar 2006 02:49 | #

Had the Japanese conquered India, the little fakir’s head would have been rolling through the dust.

True:

In 1937, Hitler explained to Foreign Secretary Lord Halifax how to control Indian nationalism: “Shoot Gandhi, and if that does not suffice to reduce them to submission, shoot a dozen leading members of [the] Congress [movement]; and if that does not suffice, shoot 200 and so on until order is established.”


40

Posted by karlmagnus on Mon, 27 Mar 2006 09:21 | #

Unlike his silly views about Jews, the Fuhrer’s thoughts on what to do with Gandhi were spot on.  The British were wimps by that stage. Curzon would have known what to do, and would thereby have saved 1 million Indian lives.


41

Posted by Phil Peterson on Mon, 27 Mar 2006 14:53 | #

Martin,

I wouldn’t call Hitler’s view of Jews “silly”. That trivialises the whole thing - the gravity of what the Nazis “inspired” by Hitler did.

I’m not sure you would have been comfortable with the hard-knuckled racism of Curzon. He was an unabashed racist (and I don’t mean that in a derogatory sense). 

He also led the opposition to women’s suffrage in 1905!


42

Posted by Phil Peterson on Mon, 27 Mar 2006 14:56 | #

The British were wimps by that stage. Curzon would have known what to do, and would thereby have saved 1 million Indian lives.

I have a feeling that one of the strongest reasons for not shooting Gandhi was the fear that it would lead to a massive violent revolt in the whole country which would become uncontrollable.

The Germans hanged anyone they hated in the Eastern front and ended up losing to the Red Army. Perhaps if they had been nicer to the Ukrainians and the Poles, who knows…...


43

Posted by karlmagnus on Mon, 27 Mar 2006 18:52 | #

Curzon was NOT a hard knuckled racist; that is a disgraceful statement.  He restored the Taj Mahal and was highly unpopular among the Indian Civil Service because of his LACK of racism.  He was merely the last Viceroy to see the evil marxist Congress party in its trrue colours.


44

Posted by Sajdah on Tue, 17 Jul 2007 15:58 | #

For ages i’ve always wondered what Edwina saw in Nehru, when she had such a handsome man for a husband - now i know thanks to you all.

Also now i know the reason why the Earl ‘put up’ with being cuckolded!

I wish we had a more open press in our country then i might have known the facts a long time back.


45

Posted by Gabriel Chistoni on Sat, 05 Apr 2008 11:56 | #

Could we know,apart Edward the 8th and maybe Noel Coward,the names (or,better)the profession of Mountbatten lovers (or tricks) ? Were they soldiers?Sailors?Navy (Army) officers ? Upper-class guys ? Grown-up men or boys ? Thanks


46

Posted by Robert Browne on Sun, 21 Mar 2010 09:50 | #

Empathy with refugees is one thing but does not imply that Irish or any people have to roll over and hand over their country to foreigners. Idiots compare Ireland with India and America which they have failed to notice are continents, which obliterated populations and engaged in mass ethnic cleansing.  What is being suggested by the fanatics of self-righteousness is that Ireland and the UK give up their countries to refugees adopt their laws to make them sharia compliant (there is money in this) We should apologise for our corrupt states and promise to work harder in order to make the newcomers more comfortable having endured, as they most certainly have, the despotism of their own religious and fanatical countries for too long.

We have 350, 000 empty residences idle in Ireland as a direct result of our capitalist greed. Why not, make these available immediately to refugees from Darfur, Afghanistan, Palestine, Iraq. No, jobs for them? But sure we will all join in and participate in the poverty, In Ireland that is second nature to us, sure we are good at that, what with famines and pestilence continuously stalking the land in previous generations this is second nature to us at this stage.  SF and Bertie Ahern’s FF knew that race, religion and culture was never the issue and that there was plenty of room on the island for them. And they have been proven right and all those roofs could be providing shelter. We could put every one of those unemployed building workers to work constructing mosques and Hindu temples Yes, SF and parties like Labour have a wonderful future mapped out for us, all we have to do is be stupid enough, myopic enough and senile enough to vote for them.



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Guessedworker commented in entry 'Not Bannon blanking his own blank, but a fellow Neo-Reactionary, Goldman-Sachs alum tasked with...' on Fri, 18 Aug 2017 17:31. (View)

Bannon out of White House commented in entry 'Not Bannon blanking his own blank, but a fellow Neo-Reactionary, Goldman-Sachs alum tasked with...' on Fri, 18 Aug 2017 13:32. (View)

Bannon said to have tendered resignation commented in entry 'Bannon's disregard of ethno-nationalism is "leaked."' on Fri, 18 Aug 2017 12:58. (View)

Japan's growth streak longest in 11 years commented in entry 'EU, Japan determined to deliver trade deal by end of 2017' on Fri, 18 Aug 2017 05:11. (View)

Animals stolen from Venezuelan zoo commented in entry 'Moscow Taking Control of Venezuelan Oil Assets, Gaining Geopolitical Foothold in Caribbean' on Fri, 18 Aug 2017 02:45. (View)

Isil claims responsibility for Barcelona attack commented in entry 'Bastille Day terror on the French Riviera' on Fri, 18 Aug 2017 02:24. (View)

Cantwell wanted for arrest commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Fri, 18 Aug 2017 02:15. (View)

Children of the revolution commented in entry 'In the end for Chester: When co-option of opposition & protest forces you to imagine different text' on Fri, 18 Aug 2017 00:35. (View)

Thoughts on Newcastle Grooming commented in entry 'Eighteen Convicted in Mostly Muslim Rape Gang, Police Paid Child Rapist Informant £10k' on Thu, 17 Aug 2017 23:00. (View)

Driss Oubakir commented in entry 'Bastille Day terror on the French Riviera' on Thu, 17 Aug 2017 22:17. (View)

Police kill five suspects in Cambrils raid commented in entry 'Bastille Day terror on the French Riviera' on Thu, 17 Aug 2017 22:00. (View)

Barcelona terror attack: 13 dead commented in entry 'Bastille Day terror on the French Riviera' on Thu, 17 Aug 2017 13:47. (View)

Red Left beats Gary Cohn's worker's Disney commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Thu, 17 Aug 2017 09:30. (View)

colored woman tears down statue commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Wed, 16 Aug 2017 22:53. (View)

Gary Cohn disgusted by Trump, Bannon proud commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Wed, 16 Aug 2017 14:18. (View)

Baltimore's Confederate monuments removed at night commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Wed, 16 Aug 2017 14:09. (View)

Sarah Champion commented in entry 'Eighteen Convicted in Mostly Muslim Rape Gang, Police Paid Child Rapist Informant £10k' on Wed, 16 Aug 2017 13:57. (View)

Cantwell: a new Hal Turner commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Wed, 16 Aug 2017 09:19. (View)

Trump: "blame on all sides" commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Wed, 16 Aug 2017 08:43. (View)

DanielS commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Tue, 15 Aug 2017 21:00. (View)

Guessedworker commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Tue, 15 Aug 2017 18:24. (View)

Unite Right Organizer, Kessler's poem White Devils commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Tue, 15 Aug 2017 15:05. (View)

DanielS commented in entry 'Marx supported black slavery in America' on Tue, 15 Aug 2017 11:08. (View)

Baked Alaska may've been blinded commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Tue, 15 Aug 2017 08:25. (View)

"couldn't just get out of the way" commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Tue, 15 Aug 2017 08:10. (View)

Robert E. Lee commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Mon, 14 Aug 2017 22:02. (View)

Friendly Fire commented in entry 'Marx supported black slavery in America' on Mon, 14 Aug 2017 18:18. (View)

DanielS commented in entry 'Are Whites stupid, or what? Tara will be an epoch light out of the darkness, especially if...' on Mon, 14 Aug 2017 01:52. (View)

Alexander Baron commented in entry 'Melissa Barto's boyfriend kills her on suspicion that she was cheating on him' on Sun, 13 Aug 2017 20:27. (View)

Didess42 commented in entry 'Are Whites stupid, or what? Tara will be an epoch light out of the darkness, especially if...' on Sun, 13 Aug 2017 19:22. (View)

Reagan Tokes commented in entry 'Black hyper-assertiveness, lack of impulse control, predatory aggression & liberal natural fallacy' on Sun, 13 Aug 2017 14:53. (View)

Fields' mother has Jewish name, "Bloom" commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Sun, 13 Aug 2017 10:12. (View)

DanielS commented in entry 'Next-level TRS: Michael ‘Enoch’ Peinovich is actually Michael ‘Enoch’ ENOCKSON Peinovich-Sippel.' on Sun, 13 Aug 2017 05:35. (View)

LeadEagle commented in entry 'Next-level TRS: Michael ‘Enoch’ Peinovich is actually Michael ‘Enoch’ ENOCKSON Peinovich-Sippel.' on Sun, 13 Aug 2017 05:09. (View)

Heather Heyer commented in entry 'Unite The Right? Let their instability emerge by contrast to our coordinated Left Nationalisms' on Sun, 13 Aug 2017 03:22. (View)

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