C’est Marine, d’accord

Posted by Guessedworker on Saturday, 15 January 2011 23:06.

The vote for the presidency of Front National was run yesterday, and the news is that Marine Le Pen has won with two-thirds of the vote. The party is convening this weekend in Tours to place her father’s mantle on her shoulders. A new chapter in the increasingly urgent struggle for a free and nationally-conscious France is beginning.

Marine’s election does two things. Most obviously, it is a generational change. It arrests the party’s post-2002 decline under her father, moving it on from the divisiveness of the French past, from all allusions to Vichy and Algiers, and from the sniping at the outrageous official genuflection before Jewry and the Holocaust narrative. Marine’s unsuccessful opponent, Bruno Gollnisch, represented all that. Marine is much more presentable and, as a lawyer and a working mother, a woman of modern-day France. She will never find herself asked in the Cour de cassation whether she agreed:

that the organized extermination of European Jews by the Nazi regime ... constitutes an undeniable crime against humanity, and that it was carried out notably by using gas chambers in extermination camps?

... and have to reply, like Gollnisch, “Absolutely.”

More importantly, perhaps, Marine’s election aligns FN with the anti-Islamicisation strategy which has born electoral fruit elsewhere in Europe. That, and not merely a desire to modernise, has dictated a break with the pro-Catholic policies of her father on women’s right, particularly with regard to divorce and abortion, and a new tolerance towards homosexuality.

In turn, this new moderation opens up the possibility of a role in a governing coalition with Sarkozy’s UMP, which is looking increasingly likely:

A TNS-Sofres poll released on Wednesday suggested 22 per cent of French people agreed with “the ideas” of the National Front, up from 18 per cent a year ago – while support from sympathisers of Mr Sarkozy’s UMP party has jumped 12 points to 32 per cent.

Equally worrying for the President, some 43 per cent of his UMP sympathisers approve forging electoral alliances with the FN according to the circumstances, the TNS-Sofres poll found.

Half of respondents said they believe France has too many immigrants, and just under half feel that Muslims have too many rights.

The poll suggests a higher number believe Miss Le Pen better represents a “patriotic right of traditional values” than her father.

In response, the Elysée and the UMP are seeking to engineer an anti-FN task-force for the 2012 election. But, tellingly, it is to be comprised not of rightists, as per the little tough guy’s aggressive strategy of drawing-off FN support in 2007, but of centrists. He can’t pull that trick twice. Attack has given way to defence.

The great unknown with Marine’s strategy, of course, is whether nationalism as a revolutionary politics can weather such proximity to, and even participation in, power without losing itself. It was noisily claimed by the Austrian centre-right that bringing Jorg Haider’s Freedom Party into government between 2000 and 2005 was the fastest way to destroy it. Having lacked the bargaining power from the outset to obtain worthwhile concessions, the party duly split between populist and nationalist factions. Both the resultant parties did quite well in the 2008 election, but it’s not a particularly encouraging example for FN.

But Marine has had time to position herself and the party, and may emerge from the 2012 election with a big enough bargaining chip to keep the party united and engaged. At the very least it would be a fine thing to force the little Hungarian Jew into coalition with the hate object he thought he had destroyed by deception in 2007.

Tags: European Nationalism

Comments:

Posted by Frank on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 07:35 | #

The A3P has also chosen not to take up abortion and marriage, which is probably a good choice. As a result, there isn’t division over these smaller issues, though they are important in more normal times.

I’m curious where these two factions differ:

[T]he party duly split between populist and nationalist factions.

Posted by the Narrator... on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 10:55 | #

That, and not merely a desire to modernise, has dictated a break with the pro-Catholic policies of her father on women’s right, particularly with regard to divorce and abortion, and a new tolerance towards homosexuality.

The Left is The Left Is The Left.

And those are leftist positions, or impositions. More than that, Female Leader = Leftism. That’s just the way it is. She herself is, essentially, an affirmative action politician. Her election represents another defeat of what’s left of the French people. Those who wish to further harm France will celebrate her rise.

And I’m not just being ‘ants at a picnic’ here. I’ve read up on her and she seems to me to be the Sarah Palin of France. She’s using the Front National as a spring board to a career. She’s catering to her crowd. She brings them nice big beautiful cakes that are easy on the eye but just more empty calories.

And this is how politics work….,

You bump elbows with peers. Political peers. They become your class and your people. Sarkozy may be slightly to the left of her ideologically, but he’ll still be a new ‘third cousin, twice removed on Grandma’s side’.

Despite what many think, politics is not like the mafia. It’s more like Junior High. There’s no intrigue, there’s “drama!”. Power in politics generally revolves around being “popular” and “cool”.

You have to think about it this way. In private, Gordon Brown may very well wish he could put every dark skinned person in Britain on a slow boat to China. Ditto Prince Charles, Tony Blair, etc… But personal convictions rarely surface in the political light.

All politics, at heart, is about marketing. It’s not about government. Government and politics are two completely separate things that only occasionally and coincidentally cross paths (and purposes).

Marketing is about popularity and popularity is a wave. Sometimes those waves gently conclude on the sandy shores and other times they conclude abruptly, crashing into the rocks.

Government is almost always in the hands of business. And business is brute force. Been that way since the first city organized itself around a gathering of traders.

Government is, paramilitary police/troops storming through the streets, kicking down doors and rounding up its opponents in the middle of the night.

Politics is, a high school musical.

At this point, the ONLY thing that can combat the brute power of business and that will extract France, Britain and the rest of Western Civilization from (what is now) certain doom, is a Tyrant-King.

We may all lament his terrible wrath after he has saved us from our enemies, but that is the price to be paid for allowing ourselves to fall so low in the first place.

And after all (and generally speaking), that is the repeated path of history.

...

Posted by Zion on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 15:03 | #

At this point, the ONLY thing that can combat the brute power of business and that will extract France, Britain and the rest of Western Civilization from (what is now) certain doom, is a Tyrant-King.

I agree. But why, exactly? You need to elaborate greatly on this thought.

As to references to this “Hungarian Jew”: what % of Sarkozy is Jewish? I thought it was only a quarter. And is he that objectionable? I know he’s not Le Pen, whom I support despite his rancid (and stupid and unnecessary) comment about the Holocaust being a “detail of history”, but has he actually been positively bad for France, or just disappointing?

Also, what is more important for French survival: expelling Jews, or Muslims? The neo-nazis here might want both, but what if that will never be possible? Many French Jews are deeply concerned about the internal Muslim threat. French Jews contribute a great deal to French life; Muslims, absolutely nothing. Wouldn’t it be wiser for the FN to start admitting Jews, being pro-Israel, etc, in light of the infinitely greater threat from the uncivilized, culturally alien, racially alien, religiously alien and radicalized, and more numerous, internally and obviously externally, Muslims?

And isn’t Gollnisch Jewish?

Posted by Zion on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 15:19 | #

Let me add that there is no hope for Western civilization unless Jews and Christians work together. Whatever our historical differences (and certainly Jews have more right to kvetch than gentiles!), Islam is the great enemy today, and it should unite us. You need the Jews, who are a lot smarter, not to mention wealthier, than whites, and much more ethnically cohesive. Contemporary (white) European anti-Semitism is mostly a leftwing phenomenon, and it stems not from nationalist criticisms, but from the same self-hatred that was directed at the poor whites in South Africa. The left hates Israel because it is white and Western and nationalist (at least in image; actually, Israel is fairly multiethnic, with a lot of ideological diversity, and not just between Jews and Arabs, but religious/non-religious Jews, Russian and non-Russian, Ashkenaz and Sephardic, and others).

I am a secular Jew, pro-Israel, pro-Christian, pro-Europe, pro-West, pro-America, pro-free markets, pro-democracy, pro-free speech - and against Muslims, who are enemies of these things. I am not the only such Jew. I think most white Christians do not care about their own race and nations. You could learn from Jews, and you could use Jewish help.

Jewish brains plus white numbers equals Europe’s survival and future.

Posted by Frank on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 15:46 | #

Zion,

without question the Jews are the greater real threat. But Muslims are an easier threat to mobilise people against.

Jews tend to be of a higher quality than Muslims, and it’s the elite that drives a country.

Reg. neo-Nazis, that’s just absurd. Nationalists are not all neo-Nazis anymore than Jews are all in the mafia.

Posted by Frank on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 15:51 | #

“Jewish brains plus white numbers equals Europe’s survival and future.”

You mean Jewish Chutzpah, and in no way would Jews ever work for European survival. Jews are obsessed with the Holocaust and with Rome attacking Israel. The entire history of Jews within Europe is seen as Jews persecuted by Europe. They define themselves as anti-Europeans.

Posted by Guessedworker on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 16:03 | #

Zion,

Try Gates of Vienna for a blog where people think Europeans and Jews should “fight Islam together”.

Posted by John on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 18:35 | #

Zion: “You could learn from Jews, and you could use Jewish help.”

I thought it was heroin addicts that steal your wallet and offer to help you look for it.

Posted by El Cid on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 18:46 | #

Who is behind mass immigration of the thirld world into white countries only ? Who is behind the massive ” antiracism- antisemitism ” movements ? Antiracism + code word for anti white. Antisemitism is a worn out shoe, an anchronism and completely out of tune with reality. Who are the brains behind the promotion and furtherance of miscegenation of non whites and whites ?, abortion, feminism, tolerance for homosexuality, all the evils assailing the Occident and the white homelands ? Who are the brains ? When it has been answered who are the movers and shakers behind all these antiwhite, anti- natonal and white genocide movements, the question of an ” alliance” to save and rescue whatever civilization is left to save becomes superfluous.

Posted by Sam Davidson on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 18:56 | #

Couldn’t they have found someone besides Le Pen’s daughter? I mean, are there no other capable nationalist leaders in France?

Let me add that there is no hope for Western civilization unless Jews and Christians work together. Whatever our historical differences (and certainly Jews have more right to kvetch than gentiles!), Islam is the great enemy today, and it should unite us.

It certainly should unite us but it hasn’t.

A good example: The Jewish community supported Muslims in the Swiss Minaret Ban:
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3814454,00.html

Posted by Hail on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 19:30 | #

Guessedworker wrote:
Try Gates of Vienna for a blog where people think Europeans and Jews should “fight Islam together”.

GoVers usually care more about Defending Israel than about any European interests. (Crypto-racialist Fjordman and some others are exceptions that prove the rule…he is as cautious as a fat man walking across a frozen lake).

Another “Counter-Islamic” site apparently-run by white-gentiles, Little-Green-Footballs, is violently anti-nationalistic for Europeans while simultaneously being violently pro-Israel. Svigor summed up that strange ideology well, here.

Is Marine Le-Pen a neoconservative, in the Geert-Wilders (and probably GoV) model? It seems not. For all the possible criticisms like Narrator’s above, it is important to remember this.

Posted by Frank on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 22:25 | #

Sam:

A good example: The Jewish community supported Muslims in the Swiss Minaret Ban

Remember a lesson from Jewish Critical theory: everything is the fault of white Gentiles.

Remember lesson number 2 from Jewish Critical Theory: we will never be certain our problems aren’t the cause of white Gentiles until there are no more of them. Whites are inherently racist, and the only way for them not to be racist is for them to cease to exist.

Any criticism of Jews by white Gentiles requires one to visit a Holocaust museum and be instructed by the Jewish version of history.

And remember, Jews are only successful because they are superior to you. Considering any other factor will get you sent back to the Holocaust museum. However, white Gentiles are only successful because of racism, hence the need for affirmative action.

And even in Zimbabwe where whites could not possibly be in power, somehow that’s the fault of whites as well. Anyone who mentions diamond mines in SA being owned by Jews needs to revisit the Holocaust museum, along with anyone who mentions American bankers or “Russian” oligarchs / mafia, etc.
-

The irony of it all is if man has striven for any one thing, it’s for a free tribal or nation-state existence. And we won’t know, until we’ve tried, if world peace wouldn’t be possible were we not living within homogeneous states. Jews should return whence they came and allow the real healing to begin, and if they insist this wouldn’t bring us healing they ought to prove it by returning along with these massive waves of aliens. Then we can all judge and see if this wouldn’t bring about a paradise.

Posted by Guest Lurker on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 22:58 | #

Let me add that there is no hope for Western civilization unless Jews and Christians work together.

Sounds like just another jewish ultimatum and threat. It always need to be on their terms. What else is new from the jew? Jews are the key to Europe’s survival and future? Then better it go down in flames.

Posted by Guest Lurker on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 23:10 | #

El Cid said:

Who is behind mass immigration of the thirld world into white countries only ?

Yes. Here in the U.S., for example, it was jewish groups which immediately rallied against the Arizona anti illegal immigration law.

http://www.jta.org/news/article/2010/04/19/1011661/groups-oppose-ariz-immigration-law

And here is an article by jew Stephen Steinlight where he admits the role of and the reasons for jewish promotion of multi-racialism in white lands, and how they pit ethnic groups against each other to “divide and conquer”.

http://www.cis.org/articles/2001/back1301.html

Posted by Hail on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 23:27 | #

Jews are the key to Europe’s survival and future?

“May heaven have mercy on the European intellect, if one wanted to subtract the Jewish intellect from it.”—Friedrich Nietzsche, 1886, letter to sister.

“The Germans themselves have no future.”—Nietzsche, 1888. [In “Nietzsche Contra Wagner”, written in the final months before Nietzsche’s mental breakdown].

Posted by Frank on Sun, 16 Jan 2011 23:45 | #

A Jewish Republic: it’s the size of Switzerland.

Posted by Guest Lurker on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 00:37 | #

“May heaven have mercy on the European intellect, if one wanted to subtract the Jewish intellect from it.”—Friedrich Nietzsche, 1886, letter to sister.

“The Germans themselves have no future.”—Nietzsche, 1888. [In “Nietzsche Contra Wagner”, written in the final months before Nietzsche’s mental breakdown].

And your appeal to a single authority’s opinion proves what, exactly?

As to Germans not having any future, or any white people for that matter not having a future without jews in their midst, in a sense this is true. The moment any white nation tries to free itself from the pernicious jewish grip, it will induce its modern golem, the U.S., to bomb it into submission and obliterate it if need be.

Posted by Zion on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 03:57 | #

Jews have historically been attracted to leftist revolutionary movements largely as a reaction to earlier Christian/gentile abuse. I’m not saying Jews are perfect or were never at fault. Some Jews have always engaged in deceptive economic practices, and that, combined with jealousy at Jewish success, has allowed for our being scapegoated for all kinds of problems we did not create. By social situation, however, Jews should be “the most conservative of peoples”, as Disraeli once put it. What stupid leftist Jews don’t understand is that revolutionary movements usually end up hurting us. Obviously, I can’t support the anti-Semitic Right, but I would much rather live in a Christian America than in the current militantly secularist, anti-Christian, liberal one - let alone in some Muslim sewer. I would also rather live among whites, as I do, than among racial minorities.

Anyway, the nazis miss my point (as do liberal Jews, with whom I argue often). Jews are very dominant in America, as well it seems (to my surprise), in Europe, especially Britain (due to American influence), France (due to numbers), and, at least ideologically, in Germany (due to historical guilt). America remains very dominant in the world, especially the white world. Anti-American nazis may not like this fact, but I’m interested only in truth. White conservatives are strangely very weak (and nazis totally discredited). Wouldn’t it make more sense for white racists (I use that word descriptively, not pejoratively) to try to persuade Jews to reevaluate their communal commitment to multiculturalism and mass immigration, than to harp on anti-Semitism? I’m serious! What’s easier - getting whites to hate Jews, or getting Jews to recognize that our own community’s survival in no small part rests on the continued existence of white nations, both for ourselves in those nations, and because only white nations have any sort of attachment to Israel, or concern for preventing anti-Semitism?

And from your perspective: wouldn’t it be nice if some of that Jewish wealth and media power could be used in a pro-white way, to work against immigration, and Islam?

White nationalists need to start thinking outside their accustomed boxes, as do Jews. The former need to rid themselves of anti-Semites, the latter, multiculturalists. It is easier for you at this time to coopt the Jews, than to get white majorities to hate and expel or murder them.

Posted by Zion on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 04:04 | #

Thank you for the referral to Gates of Vienna. Very good site. I found this one due to criticisms of Larry Auster, an excellent conservative.

All whites everywhere must make common cause against the joint Muslim enemy. This includes the most economically dynamic group - the Jews!

Posted by Helvena on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 04:33 | #

The Jews destroyed Western Civilization after WWII. I have no time for the Jews. They brought the third world to the West now let the third world devour them. The Jews got us fighting our German brothers twice, shame on us if we let them talk us into fighting our Muslim brothers. No more killing for the Jews.

http://thompkins_cariou.tripod.com/id34.html

Posted by Ivan on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 04:49 | #

Guessedworker the Chief to Zion the Pong:
Gates of Vienna - that’s where you belong
Zion the Dung won’t take old gentleman’s hint
He raves and keeps waving his circumcised dong

Posted by Guest Lurker on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 04:57 | #

Obviously, I can’t support the anti-Semitic Right, but I would much rather live in a Christian America than in the current militantly secularist anti-Christian, liberal one - let alone in some Muslim sewer.

What’s wrong with you just living in a jewish israel?

I would also rather live among whites, as I do, than among racial minorities.

And what makes you think whites would want to live among you if they were to become informed about the jewish role in our malaise? You yourself are a minority. Why would you be any more entitled to live amongst us than other minorities? If, as you claim, you’re so much smarter than whites, why would you want to continue living among us? Or is it just that we’re an easier host for you to scam and parasite off of?

Posted by Guest Lurker on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 05:03 | #

The Jews destroyed Western Civilization after WWII. I have no time for the Jews. They brought the third world to the West now let the third world devour them. The Jews got us fighting our German brothers twice, shame on us if we let them talk us into fighting our Muslim brothers. No more killing for the Jews.

AMEN! Always playing both sides when it suits them. Were it to turn out as they plan and the muslims were to be neutralized, it would be back to business as usual for Hymie, pushing multiculturalism and multiracialism, but only from non-muslim countries this time into white lands to weaken us and gain leverage, always, always, always at our expense.

Posted by Ivan on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 05:22 | #

The Jews got us fighting our German brothers twice, shame on us if we let them talk us into fighting our Muslim brothers.

The jig is up, the descendant of Zion
You are behind the curve, poor scion
My advice to you: Change your name to
al Zahn and never mention Zion again

Posted by Thunder on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 05:45 | #

Zion,

Leave now and never come back. Leave now and never come back.

Posted by Sam Davidson on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 06:00 | #

Hopefully Armor will stop by MR and give his thoughts on Marine Le Pen. I really, really, don’t want to go offtopic, but…

Wouldn’t it make more sense for white racists (I use that word descriptively, not pejoratively) to try to persuade Jews to reevaluate their communal commitment to multiculturalism and mass immigration, than to harp on anti-Semitism? I’m serious! What’s easier - getting whites to hate Jews, or getting Jews to recognize that our own community’s survival in no small part rests on the continued existence of white nations, both for ourselves in those nations, and because only white nations have any sort of attachment to Israel, or concern for preventing anti-Semitism?

There are some very good reasons why an agreement between Whites/Europeans and Jewry will not happen:

1. Jewry holds all the cards and has no need to bargain with pro-Whites.
(Hunter Wallace, despite his many faults, made an excellent post on Jewish funding power:
http://www.occidentaldissent.com/2009/11/01/jewish-power-campaign-contributions-ii/ )

2. Jews have, almost singlehandedly, brought about the current decline of the West. In the 20th century they played THE main role in the creation of Bolshevism, the funding, organization, and leadership of anti-white terrorist groups in Africa, and “Civil Rights” in the United States. They also did most of the intellectual work in building the current dogma regarding racial equality, biological “plasticity” and other such Boasian pseudo-science.

3. Any attempts to build bridges between sensible Jews and pro-Whites will be stopped by the organized Jewish community. All Jewry has to do is tell sensible Jews that these opportunistic gentiles are merely using them and that, should the gentiles gain enough power, they would turn on their Jewish allies in minutes. Thus the number of Jews who could reasonably co-exist with us, and I’m certain there are more than a few, will be herded back into organized Jewry’s camp.

4. The Jews do not need Europeans to survive. In fact, should North America and Europe be reduced to a mongrel people composed of various races with widespread political unrest and violent crime, this would suit the Jews quite well, as it reinforces their group loyalty and confirms the ancient belief that they are in fact superior to the goyim and are meant to lord above them.

Posted by Ivan on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 06:16 | #

Whites + Muslims spells death to the Jew
This is the strategy we need to review
Jews get it, and we, Muslims, get it too
The question: Whitey, what should you do?

Posted by Zion on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:20 | #

Very poor quality responses, very hateful and unintellectual, except from Sam Davidson (and what a Jewish sounding name!). So much stupidity. The problem is that white nationalists, unless conservative realists, cannot face the fact of the role of their own people in Western decline.

“Jews brought Third World to West”. Really? Who opened up US in 1965? LBJ and the young Teddy Kennedy above all. Was Trudeau a Jew? Mitterand (actually, he was a nazi)? Callaghan, Blair, Brown? De Klerk? Who are all the Scandinavian Jews demanding Islamic immigrants? Which German Jews wanted Turks (most German Jews were butchered by nazis)?.

Yes, Jews stupidly wanted mass immigration. Well, that was the Holocaust generation. But my generation is not that pro-immigration, and is getting more and more anti-Muslim immigration. That is something you could use strategically, if you racists were intelligent and cunning, like Jews. Instead, you would rather alienate an anti-Third World ally, just because I am a Jew.

No wonder you go nowhere, and ordinary whites find you repulsive. And the West hoists the banner of the wicked prophet Mahound.

Per Davidson:

1. Jews most certainly do not hold all the cards. Whites outnumber jews by many multiples, and could wipe us out if you chose - or even if you just withdrew your opposition to anti-Semitism, and support for Israel. I think eventually whites will wake up, and become nationalist to survive in a multicultural situation. Then you could learn from Jews. But when whites do wake up, and I do not want them targeting Jews, but non-white persons, especially Islamic filth.

2.“Jews brought about Western decline”. Really? Jews are that powerful? Then you should be trying to make them your ally, fools, especially as there is increasing overlap of interests. Someday, whites will have allowed themselves to be the New Jews, as they exist as minorities in their own lands. Is that situation better than allying with the Jew now?

3. Organized Jewry is not so powerful. Jews are perfectly capable of deciding things for themselves. Many of us know that our days are numbered, both in Israel and everywhere else. We are determined to survive! Liberal Jews be damned!

4. No, Jews do best among white peoples. Whites are most tolerant. Blacks are savages, Asians too alien for us to fit in or dominate, Muslims want to exterminate us like flies, we can dominate Hispanics, but their own nationalism is growing (example, Hugo Chavez, clearly a brown racist). Also, Jews look white, so we can best fit in with whites. Elsewhere we attract unwanted attention.

West will not live unless it recruits substantial number of Jews to it.

Posted by Zion on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:28 | #

Per Ivan:

You are Muslim roach! By name, probably a Bosnian, or Chechnyan, or Abkahzian, or member of Turkic Central Asian republics. ALL FILTH! Totally unable to govern yourselves in civilized white manner.

I would rather live under a Christian world order, than have anything to do with the Mohammedans.

Helvena: are you one of those British women who let themselves be pimped by Paki filth?

Muslims are not your brothers. They are the eternal enemy of western civilization, and all civilization (ask Hindus, too).

I will not leave this site until I encounter some better arguments.

Long live Blessed Zion!

Posted by Ritterkreuz on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:57 | #

First you say that Jews are powerful and smart, and that we’re weak and dumb. Then you say that Jews aren’t powerful, that they’re at our mercy. And then you end by saying that we can’t live without a “substantial number of Jews.”

When I read comments like these from Zion, I get the feeling that Captainchaos may be right - that there really is only one way, there will be only one way. All else is futile.

Posted by Ivan on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 08:25 | #

What have you done to the people of West?
Why do those nations take you for a pest?
Zion, oh Zion, would you please just repent
Why can’t you live without shitting the nest?

Posted by Guest Lurker on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 08:45 | #

Many of us know that our days are numbered, both in Israel and everywhere else.

Yes, they really, really are. Hence the desperate overtures towards white people some of you are making.

No, Jews do best among white peoples. Whites are most tolerant. Blacks are savages, Asians too alien for us to fit in or DOMINATE, Muslims want to exterminate us like flies, we can dominate Hispanics, but their own nationalism is growing (example, Hugo Chavez, clearly a brown racist). Also, Jews look white, so we can best fit in with whites. Elsewhere we attract unwanted attention.

There you have it. The logic of the human parasite laid bare. You have just made our argument for us without any of us even having to try.

Posted by Guest Lurker on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 08:55 | #

When I read comments like these from Zion, I get the feeling that Captainchaos may be right - that there really is only one way, there will be only one way. All else is futile.

I don’t understand how any white racialist at this stage can still contemplate an alternate outcome.

Posted by Guest Lurker on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 09:11 | #

Helvena: are you one of those British women who let themselves be pimped by Paki filth?

This is really rich coming from a jewish internet troll. The current furor over muslim grooming of white girls, though vile, still comes nowhere near the level of depravity of your kinsmen and their role in the white slavery trafficking of white Eastern European Slavic girls into Israel, not to mention the disgusting porn industry in the west, largely jewish. Talmudic depredations easily trump muslim depravity.

Posted by Frank on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 09:23 | #

No matter how impious or degenerate the Jews become, good European men continue to propose humane, empathetic solutions for them.

Birobidjan: The Other Jewish Republic (2005 Candour article, not the same as wiki article linked previously).

All Jews would ever have to do to ensure survival is to take their pills (for sanity) and either accept their station within Europe or move to Israel, Birobidjan, or whatever other Jewish republics are created.

Those who have taken their pills will see that the only threat to Jewish survival is and always has been: Jews. If serving a European state isn’t tolerable, then move! Every part within a state must serve the greater whole. Usury, fractional reserve banking, and great concentrations of wealth oughtn’t be legal by anyone. Alien minorities oughtn’t be allowed in the government or media. That’s what would serve the greater whole, though it would cause ridiculous, insane shrieks were such implemented.

Posted by the Narrator... on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 10:14 | #

West will not live unless it recruits substantial number of Jews to it.

Posted by Zion on January 17, 2011, 06:20 AM

This reminds me of Auster.

Why is it jewish “outreach” is always cloaked in a threat?

Zion is saying, “You need us, or else!!!!”
.
.
.

Let’s be clear here, when we speak of The West we are talking about the European family, not a philosophical construct.

Jews are not indigenous to Europe. If you’ll consult a map you’ll find that Israel (your claimed ancient homeland) is, in fact, located in Asia. In the east. In the deserts of the Orient.

There isn’t one aspect of your heritage (race, language, culture) that is in any way indigenous to Europe.

Quite the contrary, every aspect of your heritage and common modern culture is Oriental in construct and outlook.
.
.
.
...

Posted by Zion on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 12:12 | #

Does anyone here possess basic literacy skills? Your quality of reasoning is much poorer than that of most of my fellow Israeli/Jewish friends. I’m not threatening whites, only holding up the mirror of reality to them.

Can’t you see that the conflict of interests between Jews and gentiles is like that between the British and Germans in an earlier time? We are mutually suspicious of each other, direct our fire towards each other, while the common Muslim enemy (Muslims possess 10-50% admixture of negroid genes) invades our lands and very psychologies, and grows ever stronger? What is the matter with you people? Why the Jew hatred? Jews make huge contributions to Western civilization. Your American economy would be even more of a joke without its rich Jews. What positive contributions do any other minorities make?

Plus, Jews are white, too. Look at that Time magazine cover with facebook’s Zuckerberg on it. He must be a Jew (I did not read article.). Are you telling me he isn’t white??! He’s fairer-skinned than Brad Pitt, George Clooney, or Arnold Schwarzenegger, let alone Stallone or De Niro or Pacino. He has blue or green eyes, light hair. Are you idiots? If he isn’t white, what is he? Certainly he is more white than black, Chinese, Hindu, Arab or Mexican.

Ritterkreuznazi: First you say that Jews are powerful and smart, and that we’re weak and dumb. Then you say that Jews aren’t powerful, that they’re at our mercy. And then you end by saying that we can’t live without a “substantial number of Jews.”

You are misconstruing what I said. Jews are powerful, because they are intelligent, which has led to great community wealth, which leads to power in democracies. But we are potentially very weak, because we lack raw numbers. If the whole white world turned violently anti-Semitic, we could not resist them. However, you need Jews as allies and not enemies, because if you continue to alienate us and spew hatred toward us, we will then continue to resist nationalism - and then only the nonwhites (especially Muslim filth like Ivan) will win. There may be a paradox here, but no intellectual inconsistency.

Basically, you need the Jewish community to stop supporting liberalism. This will not happen unless white conservative movements (real ones, not Tories, GOP, etc) disassociate themselves from anti-Semitism.

I’m not making a threat (and I’m not Auster, a good man, however), just telling it as it is.

Finally, the ancient Jews were white (like me, and Zuckerberg). My sister is natural blonde! They have gotten darker due to non-Israelite conversions and miscegenation since Biblical times (as have Greeks, Iberians, all Mediterranean peoples).

Posted by Zion on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 12:22 | #

IT’S REALLY AMAZING HOW THE SUBSTANCE OF MY COMMENTS GOES LARGELY UNADDRESSED.

Basically, you here just hate Jews. Admit it. No matter how productive we are, law-abiding, or sympathetic to conservatism, you will still blame Jews for all your problems.

This is a really depressing commentary on human nature.

Posted by Guessedworker on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 13:57 | #

Zion,

Normally, I don’t bother to engage with non-Europeans because ethnic interest is an impenetrable wall. But I will make an exception for you. I would like you, though, to answer a single question, just to bring us into a proper relation:

Do you wish Europeans to survive as distinct ethnic groups living sovereign and free in their own lands, or do you wish for a world without the boundaries, distinctions and differences from which all strife and conflict arises, so that peace may prevail - perhaps even for all time?

Posted by Frank on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 13:58 | #

“direct our fire towards each other”

The firing is unidirectional, and Ashkenazi don’t see themselves as anything like Nordics (Brits & Germans).

“miscegenation since Biblical times”

Which is how you’ve become lighter too, though yea originally white.

“Basically, you here just hate Jews.”

That’s absurd. It’s Jews who hate Europeans. We’re only angry at what’s been done to us.

Explain why anyone would randomly grow to hate Jews. You actually believe such a thing? (No of course not - this is the usual cry of “racism”.) Do I need to cite the Jewish role in the American left this past century for you (which you of course already know)?

As an alien minority, you acknowledge that Jews cannot be trusted in certain areas of power? Jewish leftism is somewhat expected merely for their being an alien minority.

You agree with Eliot regarding multiculturalism?

The population should be homogeneous; where two or more cultures exist in the same place they are likely either to be fiercely self-conscious or both to become adulterate. What is still more important is unity of religious background, and reasons of race and religion combine to make any large number of free-thinking Jews undesirable.

Posted by the Narratror... on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 14:41 | #

Your American economy would be even more of a joke without its rich Jews

Posted by Zion on January 17, 2011, 11:12 AM

Is the American economy, which has shifted major industry to foreign lands while flooding our streets with thrid-world hordes, really something you want to take credit for?

The American economy is a monstrosity which is currently devouring White Americans. And there are too many names like Geithner and Greenspan in high finance to overlook.

The same goes for media (movies, publishing, music, news, etc….)

‘JEWISH POWER DOMINATES AT VANITY FAIR’
by Nathan Burstien

“It’s a list of “the world’s most powerful people,” 100 of the bankers and media moguls, publishers and image makers who shape the lives of billions. It’s an exclusive, insular club, one whose influence stretches around the globe but is concentrated strategically in the highest corridors of power.
More than half its members, at least by one count, are Jewish.”

The Jerusalem Post October 12 2007

.
.
.
Jews have played far to big a role in third world immigration to ignore. The phrase “melting pot” was coined by a zionist jew by the name of Israel Zangwill. That obscene little plaque on the Statue of Liberty (with its “Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses…”) was scribbled by a jewess named Emma Lazarus . The immigration travesty of 1965, which turned a 90% White nation into one barely clinging to 50%, was the work of a jew by the name of Emanuel Celler.

The list goes on.

This is nothing new though.

“It remains a fact that the Jews, either directly or through their coreligionists in Africa, encouraged the Mohammedans to conquer Spain.” The Jewish Encyclopedia (1906). Vol XI, 485.

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?pageId=56045
.
.
.
.

Finally, the ancient Jews were white (like me, and Zuckerberg). My sister is natural blonde! They have gotten darker due to non-Israelite conversions and miscegenation since Biblical times (as have Greeks, Iberians, all Mediterranean peoples).

Posted by Zion on January 17, 2011, 11:12 AM

Uh, no.

There is no genetic evidence to suggest that Greeks or Spaniards are mixed, to any substantial degree, with non-Europeans.

Don’t confuse skin tone with race. Many Chinese have white skin, but that doesn’t make them White. Pretty much every jew I’ve ever seen shows Asiatic features of one kind or another. Including your example, Zuckerberg.

As for ancient jews, I believe your own folklore/mythology betrays you there. Moses had no trouble blending in with the Egyptians, nor Esther in Persia.
They blended in with them, came to rule over them and then despoiled those nations, committing acts of mass murder in the process.

Has a familiar ring to it, no.
.
.
.

And I’ll say again, Israel is located in the east, in Asia. It’s not in Europe.

...

Posted by Helvena on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 15:25 | #

@ Zion -“Does anyone here possess basic literacy skills? Your quality of reasoning is much poorer than that of most of my fellow Israeli/Jewish friends.

And yet you can not grasp the simple notion that you and your kind are not wanted here or anywhere. Jews and Jews alone have brought themselves to the present situation and now Jews will suffer the consequences. You are your own worst enemy.

Posted by Ritterkreuz on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 18:46 | #

There may be a paradox here, but no intellectual inconsistency.

The only thing you are intellectually consistent about is Jewish supremacism.

You do not want us to be independent and free. You wish to be forever amongst us and to dominate us.

Posted by Mario on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 19:42 | #

Which is how you’ve become lighter too, though yea originally white.

No.

The European component of Ashkenazi ancestry is of recent origin.

Before that they would’ve been Middle Easterners.

It seems unlikely that their skin tone, much less their genetics, would’ve been different from other Middle Easterners in the Levant.

The Classical Authors are clear that Greeks averaged to being lighter than Middle Easterners and less light than northern European tribes.

In other words, the Middle Easterners of ancient times were darker even than Southern Europeans, much less Northern Europeans.

Why would the Jews have been different?

They wouldn’t have been White in genetics, because they’d have been far more outside the European genetic cluster than they are now (and even now their further outside than any European group thus far tested), and they wouldn’t have been all that white in appearance either.

Posted by Mario on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 19:54 | #

The fact that Jews were once essentially pure Middle Easterners is important as it explains where their evolutionary strategy came from.

Their genetics have changed since the old days, due to admixture with Europeans, but they’ve kept that old time Middle Eastern clannishness.

Some times and places, like Highland Scotland and Sicily, Europeans have been clannish.

But the general pattern is clear that Europeans tend strongly to be more individualistic than Middle Easterners.

Even Scots and Sicilians have become too individualistic for their own good lately.

But due to their recent Middle Eastern ancestry, and culture recently derived from the Middle East, the Ashkenazi manage to be more clannish even in the context of an individualism promoting age (an age they played such a huge role in creating as a means to make their advantage in clannishness over Europeans even greater).

Posted by Frank on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 20:09 | #

Mario,

populations change over time. Honestly, I’m not an Amerindian even though I live in America.

The Sumerians and Egyptians didn’t look as current populations there do today. Civilisations fall when the people who built them mix out and disappear.

I wish I had a link handy to one of the studies on Rome disappearing in the flood of slaves.

Posted by Hail on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 20:26 | #

RE Frank “Rome disappearing in the flood of slaves”—

Further, there is a correlation too perfect to be a coincidence in that in every case on record of the death or stagnation of a Culture there has been simultaneously an abortive attempt to digest large numbers of cultural and racial aliens into the organism. In the case of Rome and Greece death came about through imperialism and the resulting, inevitable backwash of conquered peoples and races into the heartland as slaves, bringing exotic religions, different philosophies; in a word, cultural sophistication first, then cultural anarchy. In the case of Persia, India and the Amerindian civilizations, a race of conquerors superimposed their civilization upon a mass of indigenous people; the area flourished for awhile, then the Culture vanished or, in the case of America, was on the verge of vanishing, as the descendants of the conquerors became soft, fat and liberal and took on more and more of the accoutrements and blood of the subject population. In the case of Egypt, the alien blood was brought in over the course of many centuries by the importation of Negro slaves. The inevitable racial mongrelization followed, creating the Egypt we know today.

We thus see the real reason underlying the “inevitable” decline and destruction of a cultural organism. It is because, at a certain stage, a Culture develops a bad case of universalism. Speaking pathologically, unless this is sublimated to harmless channels by proper treatment, it will inevitably kill the organism through the absorption of a resulting flood of alien microbes.

It is, therefore, the natural by-product of universalism which kills the organism; the death of the organism itself is neither natural nor necessary!

[From “Introduction to Imperium”, by Willis Carto]

The above is as fine a meta-narrative as one will find.

For a more technical micro-analysis of the case of the Roman Empire, see here.

Racial change as a primary cause of Roman decline

The seeds for the destruction of Rome were already sown in the transformation from Republic to Empire, which was itself symptomatic of Orientalizing influences. As the empire progressed, Romans failed to reproduce their numbers, and many of those who remained dispersed to the colonies. Huge numbers of slaves were imported into Italy from the Near East. And Roman slaves were, for the most part, non-European.

“Therefore, when the urban inscriptions show that seventy per cent of the city slaves and freedmen bear Greek names and that a larger portion of the children who have Latin names have parents of Greek names, this at once implies that the East was the source of most of them, and with that inference Bang’s conclusions (Dr. Bang of Germany) entirely agree. In his list of slaves that specify their origin as being outside Italy (during the empire), by far the larger portion came from the Orient, especially from Syria and the provinces of Asia Minor, with some from Egypt and Africa (which for racial classification may be taken with the Orient). Some are from Spain and Gaul, but a considerable portion of these came originally from the East.

Very few slaves are recorded from the Alpine and Danube provinces, while Germans rarely appear, except among the imperial bodyguard. Bang remarks that Europeans were of greater service to the empire as soldiers than servants.”

(Frank, Tenney 1916 ‘Race mixture in the Roman Empire’: American Historical Review, Volume 21, pp. 700,701).

Posted by Ivan on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 20:52 | #

America’s got lazy and fat with the help of Zion’s kin
It was them who made your dollar the tool for looting
We’ll dump the dollar, and you’ll dump the jew
That’ll make us less mean and you - healthy and lean

Posted by Frank on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 20:53 | #

Hail,

I tend to forget the quality of MR posters. I do appreciate the quotes and links.

Posted by Guest Lurker on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 21:50 | #

GW said:

Normally, I don’t bother to engage with non-Europeans because ethnic interest is an impenetrable wall.

That’s probably the wisest policy. It’s an impossible task trying to explain to a parasite why it should desist from parasitism.

Best not to feed this disruptive troll. I doubt he came here in good faith in the first place as he claims, which is why he lingers on even though his overtures have been rebuffed.

Posted by Ivan on Mon, 17 Jan 2011 22:02 | #

No, Jews do best among white peoples. Whites are most tolerant. Blacks are savages, Asians too alien for us to fit in or dominate, Muslims want to exterminate us like flies, we can dominate Hispanics, but their own nationalism is growing (example, Hugo Chavez, clearly a brown racist). Also, Jews look white, so we can best fit in with whites. Elsewhere we attract unwanted attention.

Zion the Clown seems too dumb for a Jew
All this charade is too good to be true
Is that how sound a kike out of his psyche?
Let us show mercy and preserve him for zoo

Posted by Armor on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 01:22 | #

Sam Davidson: “Couldn’t they have found someone besides Le Pen’s daughter? I mean, are there no other capable nationalist leaders in France?”

It should have been the Front National’s job to rally capable nationalists into a common movement. But Le Pen has been criticized for transforming his political party into a Front Familial, and getting rid of internal opposition.

I hope Marine Le Pen will be able to help stop today’s immigration policy. But I certainly had a preference for her challenger. Here is an article by Robert Spieler, the chairman of a small political party that fights against race-replacement. In the first part, he says that Gollnisch has been courageous in resisting external enemies, but that he let himself be unfairly treated by the Le Pen family. My translation of the second part :

National Front Presidency: what to make of it?
(...)
Many say that the media and Sarkozy had decided to support Marine Le Pen, thinking she would be less dangerous to the system that Bruno Gollnisch. Actually, I do not completely agree with this analysis. The media are not interested in the content, but in the style, where Marine outperforms her opponent, and so “sells” better. As for Sarkozy, it is certainly not in his interest to have as an opponent a candidate who is credited with flattering polls for the next presidential election, and who could set him back far behind the socialist candidate (...). The fact remains that Marine Le Pen is trying to join the system and that the Front National can no longer be considered, from now on, as a nationalist movement defending our identity, but as the equivalent of the movement Gianfranco Fini had created in Italy, betraying his ideals, and betraying the memory of Giorgio Almirante. This had allowed Fini to join the government before he was sidelined by Berlusconi. Now he arduously gets 3% of the vote in polls.

The future of the FN and of the nationalist movement

Before long, the FN will no longer have regional representatives. And practically no candidate will make it to the second round of the cantonal elections. Blame it on yet another tampering of the electoral system. This movement, which could have been a beacon of resistance, was unable, by Le Pen’s will, to establish a genuine school of leaders, equipped with a solid ideological foundation, and with local roots, a guarantee of durability. And without trained leaders, fully aware of the stakes, and impervious to discouragement, it is impossible to withstand the trials ahead and the temptations to completely join the System. After all, why those tempted by collaboration would do it halfway? The future of the nationalist movement no longer involves the Front National, but requires that all the forces of national and European resistance get together, once the necessary clarifications have been made concerning the attitude and ideology to be adopted.

Let’s get to work.

(source)

Posted by Thunder on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 02:52 | #

Go away Zion. We have already wasted too much time talking to your kind. I have nothing but contempt for you and your kind. We do not need or want your ‘help’, association or bullshit. Go away.

Posted by Ivan on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 03:39 | #

Thank you, Zion, for being poster boy
Will you forgive me for being nasty goy
See, you are a jew, and we are gentile
Whatever annoys you - for us is a joy

Posted by Zion on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 03:48 | #

Guessedworker:

Excellent question! You among the trash seem possibly civilized, like the old-fashioned Europeans (I’m still appalled at the gross behavior of the English when I visited there about 9 years ago; nothing like the old movies, or 19th or early 20th century novels, whether Dickens, or Eliot, or Waugh, or Wodehouse, etc).

I am in agreement with what I believe is your position. I wish for the European peoples to survive, each individually as well as the collective continent - but only to the extent that they become more conservative and recover their fine old cultures, which they have thrown away since World War Two. I like the Europeans, I greatly esteem and treasure their traditional cultures and civilization, and believe that it would be a great loss for all humankind if white Europeans were to disappear, in part because that would nullify any possibility of the Europeans returning to their true selves, and ESPECIALLY if they were to disappear under a tidal wave of Islamic filth, as seems to be happening now.

If the survival of Europeans requires expulsions of Jews, I would welcome that, for two reasons. First, I would like Europe to survive, and assume that if you are expelling Jews, you would also be expelling Muslims (if not, if there were to be some kind of Nazi/Muslim alliance, then I would be your implacable enemy), and all other nonwhite persons. Second, Israel needs more Jews (especially Ashkenazis; the non-Ashkenaz are much less superior, competent, etc) to make up for our overly humanitarian approach to the Palestinians, who in consequence are demographically outcompeting us, except for the ultra-orthodox, who contribute nothing to Jewish defense, and very little to economy.

I do not want a world with no boundaries - the great leftist dream - because I am a eugenicist (ideologically, not professionally), and want to see a much smaller but much better quality human population, not destroying the planetary environment, and producing great cultures and civilizations. Mixture leads to degradation (the “one rotten apple” phenomenon). Look at the Jews. You have an article posted about Jewish eugenics. We have pursued eugenics apparently for centuries (I learn about this stuff from the Right, not Jews, except Nathanial Weyl - trust me, I was never taught anything about eugenic realities in Hebrew school), and yes, look at how superior we are, by even your own admission, according to whom this tiny minority controls everything. That’s not empirically true, of course, but Jews are heavily overrepresented in accomplishments, much to other peoples’ envy, which is what is really behind much hatred, among Europeans, and especially among the truly barbaric and incompetent Muslims.

Also, I do not believe that no boundaries will lead to peace. In the short term, it will lead to much greater strife, and misery for the superior peoples, as with whites having to be racially integrated with blacks, or French with Arabs. In the long term, it will lead to collapse of civilization, and re-tribalization of mankind anyway, only under new, postmodern or post-civilized, tribal formations. Tribes outcompete lone individuals, for reasons that should be obvious. Again, look at the Jews - and learn!

Anyway, please understand. Most of what I say is directed to America, with its large and very extensively integrated Jewish population, not Europe. There really aren’t that many Jews left in Europe - and yet you Europeans have still managed to make a complete racial and economic mess of your continent. All Jews’ fault? Are you really so stupid as to believe that? So lacking in historical understanding, or strategic perspective?

Basically, white nationalists are like Jews in outlook, and resent the fact that most of their fellow whites are so easily brainwashed by liberalism, and do not share their nationalism. But however that may be, demography is destiny, and all superior peoples, Europeans and Jews (and maybe even Japanese, too), need to work together to prevent the collapse of high civilization under a demographic onslaught of blacks, Arabs, Hindus and Latinos, with the ultimate victory going to the cruel and disgusting Chinese.

Posted by Frank on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 04:59 | #

Marine Le Pen, the next Evita? She’ll need to find her Juan Perón if so.

Posted by Ivan on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 05:09 | #

Dear Zion, have you ever flown on the board of El Al?
Our Muslim brother, who have, by the name of Bellal:
The stench inside that airliner was beyond the pale.
Let me tell you: Don’t fly with El Al - it is nooo halal!

Posted by Bill on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 14:03 | #

I’ve been nosing around the Telegraph’s blog-spot this last few days and it seems there’s been a sort of permanent feature of bash the immigrants. It could be me, as I don’t, or haven’t been in the habit of frequenting such a place.

I could not help but contrast what battles I had to post the most benign comments on the subject of immigration - and yet it seems like only yesterday. Now days, almost anything is published providing it keeps within the bounds of law and decency.

The current invitation to bash the immigrant is in today’s Telegraph and is entitled

Inner-city Birmingham is not some sort of post-apocalyptic Islamic ghetto. It’s just poor

By Danial Knowles.

GW is this you? Comment by handle cotewood @ approx 12.15PM.

Young Daniel

I am assuming here that you are English or at least native British by descent, and not Jewish because, as a Jew, you will not need to be told this. You have always known.

So, English Daniel ...

You appear either never to have known or to have forgotten - I suspect the former - that you are a son of our people, you are our blood, our kind. You are NOT an individual, not a member of a multicultural society, not a modern person with lots of black and Asian friends.

You are a member of a dying people. The blacks and Asians are being used to race-replace us - it’s inevitable when an endless flow of racial aliens with a youthful profile and a high fertility are encouraged into the living space of a people with an ageing profile and a low fertility.

If we do not want us to die - that is, to be replaced by and turned into something which is not us - we have to re-awaken to our selves as a people, and re-vivify our mutual bonds and our determination to live.

We cannot go on accepting the presence of racial aliens in our beloved land. We have to understand why they are here, whose interests they serve, and all that must be done so that we remain who we are.

That is our human right. We, too, have the right to life and land that all native peoples have.

So I ask you, as an Englishman, to start thinking seriously. Not about jobs for Moslems. But about the life of the English. Wake up. Be brave and independent of mind, and do the difficult, right thing.

I asked a little while back (here @ MR) about the unholy alliance between the West’s left and Islam, as very little conversation takes place on the subject.

I notice (on comment sections) that there is very little awareness of what immigration is all about, (it’s a bit like PC, they must be mad) which bodes ill because these commenters are the intelligent ones.

I notice that something like 80% of the electorate at the recent Oldham and Saddleworth by-election happily voted for the multicults. One old dear on Television said to the BBC man, ‘Well, if your working class you vote labour - doncha’?

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danielknowles/100072340/inner-city-birmingham-is-not-some-sort-of-post-apocalytic-islamic-ghetto-its-just-poor/#dsq-content

Posted by Guessedworker on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 15:22 | #

Erm ... ah ... err ... yes.

Posted by uncle joe on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 16:42 | #

Of all I’ve seen & fancied
In forty years and a while -
have yet to “behold, an Israelite indeed,
in whom there is no guile.”

Less that JAP slut I jimmied,
a lusty grub of the woodpile
not a bit chosen or timid:
marred by a goy sans wile.

Posted by Bill on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 16:46 | #

Guessedworker wrote: 01/18/11, 02:22 PM.

Erm ... ah ... err ... yes.

Thanks for that.

Posted by uncle joe on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 17:02 | #

not destroying the planetary environment, and producing great cultures and civilizations

If Germans and the green movement ruled the Earth, we might see the one without the other. But thank the gods, neither does.

Europeans and Jews (and maybe even Japanese, too), need to work together to prevent the collapse of high civilization under a demographic onslaught of blacks, Arabs, Hindus and Latinos, with the ultimate victory going to the cruel and disgusting Chinese.

Ah. Another century of hearing how much we need you, then.

Posted by Zion on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 22:45 | #

Posted by Guessedworker on January 18, 2011, 02:22 PM | #

Erm ... ah ... err ... yes.

Is that all you have to say to my lengthy response to your question?

Posted by Rollory on Tue, 18 Jan 2011 23:12 | #

Posted by Bill on January 18, 2011, 01:03 PM
GW is this you?

Posted by Guessedworker on January 18, 2011, 02:22 PM
Erm ... ah ... err ... yes.

Zion, the world doesn’t revolve around you. I know, I know, your religion tells you otherwise. Life is full of disappointments.

Posted by Guessedworker on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 01:49 | #

Zion,

The ums and ahs were in reply to Bill, not you. But you are right, it would be ungracious in the extreme to ignore your post, so ...

I’m English. You probably know that the English had what might be termed a quiet relationship with Jews until the outbreak of WW2. I don’t know why. Maybe the 50,000 Jews who arrived in the 19th century were bigger and better men than the “German emigres” who came in the 1930s. In any event, they were overwhelmingly working people, not a self-defined class of cultural, financial and political artistes, and as such they found acceptance. There was something about the English life that suited them. London was an international city and the gateway to the Empire. Perhaps that was it.

In any event, there were many more Jews in England who found satisfaction in life in England than there were malcontents. One of them was the literary critic John Gross, whom Charles Moore writes about here:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/columnists/charlesmoore/8263465/A-Jewish-boys-profound-faith-in-England.html

But that changed, I think, with the ingress from the continent after 1933. I don’t know when or where I read it - a long time ago - but I came across an article once that claimed that the Jews of England, whose fathers had seen Disraeli in Downing Street, were shocked by the rancour and aggressivity of the newcomers. Sharp reminders about what it is to be a Jew and about the place of the gentile, German or English, were flung in the faces of the established community, and a vigorous debate about the proper attitude of Jews towards their host ensued.

The outcome of the debate I do not know. But it didn’t really matter, because Jewish money had bought to the States as many of the Frankfurt people as wanted to come, and the fortunes of war and the political power of US Jewry did the rest. The tenor for the whole of the European world was being set, and the rest we know.

You must know of the battle of Cable Street in 1936, when Mosley attempted to march through the East End. The story goes that when the trouble kicked off, one notoriously unruly family climbed out onto the roof of a building and began hurling roof tiles at the blackshirts below.

Seeing this, and seeing that the offenders were not Jews but Londoners like him, one of Mosley’s men screamed up at them, “They’re fucking yids!”

“They may be yids,” came the reply, “But they’re our fucking yids.”

That affection, and the affection by return of John Gross, has gone. It will not come back. By way of illustration:

Two years ago a customer of mine, one of a pair of quite elderly brothers who ran a light engineering business, was attacked outside his home by two negroes. It was a Saturday morning, and he had gone out to his car, which was parked in the road (this being north London) a few yards from his front gate. He had seen the negroes loitering on the pavement, and got a very bad feeling as he got nearer to them. He turned to go back but they ran after him. He was felled by a strike to the head with a large knife that took off his right ear. While he was on the ground the negro with the knife struck him three more times, only stopping when the handle of the knife broke off, leaving the blade in his thigh.

He survived, and I met him a few weeks later. He told me that when he was lying on the ground he cried out “Don’t kill me”, but the negro’s eyes were rolled back and “there was no one there”, he said. Well, naturally, I expressed my shock and sympathy, and I went on to tell him that this sort of thing is too unbearable and not at all uncommon. We have to start thinking of ourselves. And if that means we cannot continue to support the offending community in our midst, so be it. I was judicious in the way I presented this argument, careful not to look like another blackshirt, and inclusive of him as a Jew. Do you think he agreed with me? Not a bit. He looked down so as not to meet my eye, and said, “I don’t know, I don’t know.” It was obvious that if an experience like that was the price of keeping negroes in England, well it had to be paid by someone. Bad luck on him, then. But the negroes leaving? No, they were an asset.

So what I am saying is that once upon a time there was some prospect that Jews might live alongside the English, at least, with sufficient mutuality of respect and affection for the relationship to sustain. I won’t claim that it was a strong prospect, but it was a real one. Not any more. The entire social and political dispensation of those pre-war years has gone forever, and it is now clear that Jewish interests, as represented by organised Jewry and by vocal Jews, are wholly anti-host. And we did not initiate this change. We have, though, to survive it.

Posted by Frank on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 02:55 | #

GW,

similar stories exist of Jews from Eastern Europe overwhelming Jews in America who hadn’t caused problems.

While that might be true for America, I’m doubtful of England due to the Rothschilds and Disraeli. Similarly, wasn’t it largely Jews who invested English capital in pre-WWII Germany?

Zion,

in one of the articles I linked, this was included:

Their landless condition has meant that the Jews haye been able to survive only by exploiting the resources of the various peoples with which they have come in contact inevitably provoking hostility and defensive action. The only real solution to this is the establishment of a Jewish homeland (or set of homelands) in which (the vast majority of) the Jewish race will actually reside as an alternative, not in addition to their current dispersal throughout the world. It was precisely such a homeland that both Kalinin’s Birobidjan and (in its original inception) Herzl’s Israel were supposed to provide; both have failed to solve the Problem.

The goal is to find a humane solution for all. Catherine the Great also attempted this.

Though I’m an American and the laws wouldn’t apply to me, I would like to point out that an additional 6 million were supposedly killed in WWI as well.

Posted by Sam Davidson on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 05:39 | #

Zion,

If you want an agreement between white/european nationalists and Jewry then you need to be convincing Jewry - not us.

Posted by Wandrin on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 10:43 | #

But that changed, I think, with the ingress from the continent after 1933.

I think that’s the crux. When they’re in small numbers they tuck in under the wing of the national elite and act as their auxiliaries. How malign, neutral or benign they are is then decided by how malign, neutral or benign the native elites are.

But if jews become numerous enough to think they can physically replace the native elite then the host nation is doomed unless they expel the jews before it’s too late.

Posted by Frank on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 11:59 | #

Wandrin,

I’ve been wanting to read: The Jewish War of Survival - by Arnold Leese. And if that magazine, btw, turns out to have transformed from nationalist into transhumanist I’ll scream. It looks very good from what I can discern at present.

Partly why Eastern European Jews were so aggressive is they came from poverty caused by overpopulation that couldn’t be supported by a tiny economic niche: creating hardships which they, as always, blamed Gentiles for.

It is painful to judge Jews as a whole since we all know decent Jews. Even when they’re calling for Muslim blood, mass immigration, and hate speech laws; they’re generally decent otherwise. They just don’t know any better. To make matters worse, they’re narcissists; and narcissists never amount to much because one can’t correct flaws he doesn’t have.

Posted by Zion on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 14:19 | #

Guessedworker,

Thank you for the reply. You have a quiet and affecting style of writing.

The elderly Jewish victim you described is probably a thoroughly nice person (unlike the majority of blacks and Arabs), but of course a brainwashed fool.

But, are you so so so sure you would not have obtained the same response from one of your true countrymen? Remember that stupid American couple, whose pretty blonde daughter was some retarded anti-apartheid activist in South Africa who got herself murdered by black savages, who then wept and forgave and prayed with the black murderers in court? I mean, what the hell??? Whites are really weird, face it. Not in a million years would any black ever behave like that. They want revenge for even imaginary crimes.

Your people are very PC-indoctrinated, maybe even more so than white Americans. I’m not convinced you’re not reading too much into the ethnic angle with that vignette.

I said some really PC-outrageous things after 9/11 (I’m a dual citizen, America and Israel - I’ll say more on this later) about the insanity of allowing Islamic immigrants into the West, and how we would not be able to fight a war with Muslims, while allowing a huge Muslim community in our midst - without losing American liberties. I suppose I was wrong, though time will tell .. I may one day be proven right ...

Anyway, even after we’d just been bombed (I’m not in New York, though I am in Boston, which is psychologically not too far away, plus of course I have lots of friends in the tri-state area), a lot of whites here still couldn’t bring themselves to shed the racial PC nonsense, and admit that having a Muslim community in the US was a constant danger to the well-being of Americans.

Liberal suicidism is not only a Jewish trait.

But though your larger point about the Euronationalist desire for territorial segregation from Jewry is well taken, I have raised very important issues that remain unaddressed, by either you or your consigilieri (if that is the right term; perhaps “comrades” or even “epigones”).

My points may be summarized as follows:

1. As noted, I’m not opposed to European expulsions of Jews, provided: a) there are similar expulsions of all other non-Europeans; b) Jews are allowed to take their monies out of the countries, and due compensation is made for loss of real property, if Jewish ownership were to be revoked; c) historically significant Jewish sites (graves and at least the oldest or largest and most famous synagogues) were left standing, even if with gentile groundskeepers (I assume you would want us to respect Christian sites in the Holy Land, right?); and d) formal diplomatic ties were maintained, and treaties of mutual non-aggression signed, with Israel.

These are fairly enormous concessions for a Jew to make! Would they meet with your approval? Or, like Hitler, do you want an entire planet that is judenrein?

2. The chief threat to European survival (I mean the European nations specifically, not “whites” everywhere), however, is not Jews, but Muslims. Agree or disagree? If the latter (which I admit I would find preposterous), why?

3. What I say about the white nations of Europe, I do not at all apply to America (and maybe not to Russia, either - though I don’t know enough, and the situations are different). America is a New World, sparsely inhabited by natives, and subsequently founded and built up into what it is today by whites - but not only Anglo whites (though they were most important), but by whites from all over, very much including a large number of Jews. It’s a cliche of Jewish propaganda - but true - that there were Jews in America before 1776 (unlike Muslims!). Moreover, there have been large numbers of Jews in US since the 1870s on. My own family are German Jews on both sides, who came here in the 1870s and 1880s (my parents strangely moved to Israel when I was in grade school - a long story - but I returned to US for college, and have remained ever since, though I visit Israel and my parents as often as possible).

Who here would have the nerve to say that I’m not a real American? I wonder if my family hasn’t been paying taxes to this country longer than some of the American nazis. Maybe no Jew could ever be a real Englishman, or Frenchman, and so on. Those are ancient, and until recently, fairly pure ethnicities and ethnocultures. But America? It’s had different European ethnic groups for a very long time, since pre-1776. Jews may not be as American as Anglos or Scotch-Irish, but we are every bit as American as Irish Catholics or Italians or most East Europeans. That is, we have been here in substantial numbers just as long, and we have been every bit as influential and contributory (actually more so, to be strictly, empirically truthful). You think Polish-Americans, for example, have contributed as much to building up America as Jewish-Americans? Absolute lie.

Jews will never leave America, nor should we by any moral right be expected to. Unlike Mexicans, we have a title based on history (Mexicans claim that, too, but it’s all false). Unlike blacks, we have made positive contributions. For American Jews, this is OUR COUNTRY, too, just like with any other ethnic white group!

4. But my real argument to you here is this, as I stated: demography is destiny, and all superior peoples, Europeans and Jews (and maybe even Japanese, too), need to work together to prevent the collapse of high civilization under a demographic onslaught of blacks, Arabs, Hindus and Latinos, with the ultimate victory going to the cruel and disgusting Chinese. Jews are very civilized people, too liberal certainly, but we help make prosperity. We are clearly eugenic. We donate lots of money to civc projects and charities (not only Jewish ones, either - you look at the donor lists of major cancer organizations, or performing arts groups - and be educated). We are not destroying the West. It is the nonwhites who are ruining civilization.

I make pro-conservative arguments among Jews (including against immigration), and I make anti-anti-Semite arguments among nationalists. There is no contradiction.

Posted by Zion on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 14:38 | #

Also, to others: you need to be careful about the generalizations you make about Jews. Can you make generalizations about English? Maybe a bit, but not as much as with blacks.

The higher quality the people, the more individuated their members. The gross generalizations about Jews are ludicrous, if one knows as many Jews as I do. There are pushy Jews, and non-pushy ones, just as there are dumb Irish, and some very smart ones, at least here in US. There are also dumb Jews.

The real issue is the in group / out group distinction. Jews are “out”, and so their disproportionate success, based on superior IQ as well as motivation, is disproportionately noticed, and resented.

But this is all irrelevant to the real issue. We are like two great noblemen in a duel, while swarms of savage looters and rapists wait to pounce on the “winner”.

My point is that nationalists waste their time obsessing over Jews (and yes Jews need to get over the liberal guilt and minority self-identification).

Otherwise, the only winners will be black savages, Islamic filth - and cruel Asians.

Posted by Frank on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 14:54 | #

Jews are “out”, and so their disproportionate success, based on superior IQ as well as motivation, is disproportionately noticed, and resented.

You’re suffering from cognitive dissonance old chap. Jews tend to act against the West because they’re an out group.

The higher quality the people, the more individuated their members.

And yet, we must struggle with our mighty IQs to pinpoint just what the Jewish impact is. A good Jew could give birth to a bad Jew, and a bad Jewish elite could mislead the decent sort. I’ve relatives who are Jewish through marriage. Their mighty IQs lead them to follow the neocons. They support mass immigration and miscegenation. Otherwise, they’re wonderful people, and I don’t mean that sarcastically. They are legitimately good people.

and cruel Asians.

East Asians? They’re the only minority to actually serve the greater whole somewhat. As with any, they’re unwanted, especially if they get into the elite; but they’re not cruel I think. I’m an admirer of Japan myself, to the point of learning some Japanese Kanji. Bushido is beautiful.

A West that strives to preserve its identity within a nation-state would be a natural ideological ally of Japan, as well Korea. Nation-states athwart the cosmopolitans!

Posted by Frank on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 15:01 | #

At Thanksgiving in front of the Jewish relative who comes during that time, my grandfather retold a story of a true Southern lynching during Reconstruction… The couple (Gentile and Jew) jumped in their seat.

Truly, Reconstruction was an attempt at raping and destroying the South via divide-and-conquer (as is being used against the US and soon Europe). We had to fight to free ourselves. However, you can’t explain that to Yankees.

The South was the good side, but we lost. At the time it was commonly said we’d won the moral victory. However…, history is not what it was.

Posted by Frank on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 17:11 | #

Zion,

I say this tongue-in-cheek, but:

you seem to suffer a pathology whereby every European Gentile is seen as a German. You’re aware this is an English site with many American posters? I myself have never read much about WWII or NS, so I certainly couldn’t be accused of continuing that tradition. Furthermore, I’ve no German blood; and my folks served the Allies.

The reason I say it’s tongue-in-cheek is, Jews of the past century declared conservatives were suffering “pathologies”. And it worked fairly well…

Anyway, if you stick around here, you might learn truths you didn’t want to know, including that “vile anti-Semites” aren’t so aweful as you’ve been told.

Posted by Sam Davidson on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 18:23 | #

These are fairly enormous concessions for a Jew to make! Would they meet with your approval? Or, like Hitler, do you want an entire planet that is judenrein?

I see nothing wrong with a mutual agreement. The problem is whether one can uphold such a bargain.

From what I understand, German policies until 1939 were mostly designed to force Jews to leave Germany and drive them out of the professions. It was during the winter of 1941 that there was a shift in policy towards forced relocation and alleged extermination. Hitler’s decision to, basically, fight a war against every major power on earth was the result, justified or not, of his perception that Jewish figures in Great Britain (Hore-Belisha), America (Morgenthau), and the Soviet Union (the “Jewish Commissars”) were in a de facto alliance against him. Remember that throughout the 1930s the Soviet Union (Litvinov) had been advocating a broad front against Fascism throughout Europe, and as early as 1937 Roosevelt had been speaking of a “quarantine” on Germany. I’m not saying, “Hitler was right!”, but the Axis had reasons of its own for behaving as it did.

Ultimately, had the Jews not caused so much trouble during the Russian Revolution and the various uprisings throughout Europe that followed, men like Hitler would not have been nearly as anti-semitic. Nearly all of the Communists who attempted to seize power following the German capitulation were Jews. Hitler said, “I have nothing at all against the Jews themselves. But Jews are all Communists, and these are my enemies. . . All Jews stick together like burrs.”

The point of this long argument is that the Jews are, for whatever reason, born revolutionaries. In every instance that I can find, the Jews are always on the side of subversion against the dominant people. I have never seen anyone successfully argue that any nation or government has ever benefited, longterm, from Jewry. On a personal level one can find certain Jews to be agreeable individuals, but at the community level they are always a reservoir of bolshevism and upheaval. If three men walk along a road, the Jews will find some way to turn two against one, and the pair against each other. Even the German historian of Rome and philosemite Theodor Mommsen admitted that in the Roman empire the Jews had been the “ferment of decomposition” eroding national groups and helping to “integrate” them into the greater Empire.

If YOU can change the character of Jewry and its historical momentum, then those of us left in the ruins of post-Nuremberg civilization will consider negotiations. Looking into the future all of this seems rather futile although I don’t like to admit it. Most likely, in the next hundred years someone like Mugabe will take power in a country with nuclear weapons and precipitate a war that ends all life on this planet. Change we can believe in! Then, all this discussion on the internet between nonexistent Fuehrers and Elders of Zion will have been pointless twaddle.

Posted by Ritterkreuz on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 21:12 | #

We are clearly eugenic.

Jews clearly aren’t eugenic in any genuine sense of the term. They can’t subsist and thrive on their own in nature. They’re not whole beings. More like incomplete parts. They require hosts. That’s what your desperate pleading is about, and it suggests that on some level you are aware of this fact.

Posted by Ritterkreuz on Wed, 19 Jan 2011 21:14 | #

“Zion” basically wants Euro meat/cannon fodder against the Muslims and Chinese since he fears they may be resistant to the traditional methods of Jewish subjugation and domination involving infiltration, subversion, and financial, political, cultural, social manipulation.

Posted by Ivan on Thu, 20 Jan 2011 05:04 | #

I’m English. You probably know that the English had what might be termed a quiet relationship with Jews until the outbreak of WW2. I don’t know why… But that changed…

Sharp reminders about what it is to be a Jew and about the place of the gentile, German or English, were flung in the faces of the established community, and a vigorous debate about the proper attitude of Jews towards their host ensued.

The outcome of the debate I do not know. (GW)

My dear GeeDoubleU
Here is a clue for you
When clearly stated
It’s not complicated

Once healthy, the Brit got with Jew in cahoot
Our Jew was a good Jew - said Briton the coot
Wedding the Jude for a loot - always nicht gut
The deadly infection has eaten into the root !

Posted by Bill on Thu, 20 Jan 2011 09:21 | #

Posted by Bill on January 18, 2011, 01:03 PM | #

I’ve been nosing around the Telegraph’s blog-spot this last few days and it seems there’s been a sort of permanent feature of bash the immigrants. It could be me, as I don’t, or haven’t been in the habit of frequenting such a place.

Fast forward a couple of days, (today 20th January 2011) and the immigrant bashing invitation theme goes front page headlines.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/religion/8270294/Tory-chief-Baroness-Warsi-attacks-bigotry-against-Muslims.html#dsq-content

Nearly 1500 comments and counting - what’s going on here?

Posted by Rollory on Fri, 21 Jan 2011 00:50 | #

Out of curiousity, where are these 1500 comments? When I go to that link there is nothing on the page indicating any commenting feature anywhere - just links to twitter and facebook and the like.

Posted by Bill on Fri, 21 Jan 2011 13:40 | #

Rollory January 20, 2011, 11:50 PM

Out of curiousity, where are these 1500 comments?

When I next visited this article I was bemused to find the comments to which I referred had been removed. I initially thought DT were working on the piece and would resume whenever they had completed whatever they were doing. However, as you rightly point out, the comments had indeed vanished.

What is interesting is, in today’s DT comment section there is a continuation of Baron Warsi’s piece by DT journalist Peter Oborne. At present the number of comments is approaching 1000. (973)

There is one comment by someone calling himself Ratchadman (15min ago no time) who writes -

It’s a pretty good guess we are - 1500 comments deleted and 99% anti-muslim. Gotta go with the numbers..

I can only guess Ratchadaman is referring to the same 1500 votes as yourself. (actually there was 1497) comments when I was viewing.

It seems natural to assume that those 1497 comments were taken down - for whatever reason will forever remain a mystery.

It is not unusual to refer to an article or comment whatever, only to find same has been lost to the ether. Maybe there are interesting reasons why they are removed, in fact the reasons for removal would be more interesting than the content itself.

The Peter Oborne continuation article is here. It will be interesting to see what happens to the comments. Hurry whilst comments last.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/peteroborne/100072900/hatred-of-muslims-is-one-of-the-last-bastions-of-british-bigotry/#dsq-content

I have been a keen observer for several years on how the MSM blogosphere deals with the subject of immigration. This is a complex subject in itself and I do not pretend to know the strategy or nuances they employ. I only know that over the space of a few years what was once a wall of silence has been transformed into a tsunami of comment.

How long can they continue to tell us how enriching it all is?

Posted by Guessedworker on Fri, 21 Jan 2011 14:24 | #

Bill,

The reason those comments were moved can be summed up in one word: exhaustion.

The Telegraph operates under an editorial order for edit-moderation. They try not to remove whole comments but to excise the bits that cause liberal nausia, leaving a sanitised version for the sanitised minds of the sanitised readership. They hope. It’s doable when lead articles are the sort of inoffensive pablum that no one can connect to The Great Issue. They can cope with the few per cent of comments that qualify for sanitisation. But when there are thousands of them, all pressing on the boundaries of Tory hysteria, well, it’s not at all doable. The limit has been well and truly reached.

These comment horror stories started, in fact, not in the Telegraph but in the Indy, where the hated Yasmin Alibhai-Brown vents her spleen. For several weeks now she has been venting it with the comment facility switched off entirely. The editor just can’t stomach the revolting peasants any longer.

Posted by Bill on Fri, 21 Jan 2011 15:54 | #

GW January 21, 2011, 01:24 PM

Bill,

The reason those comments were moved can be summed up in one word: exhaustion.

Operation overload - saturation commenting. Arthur Harris style, overwhelm the defences.

Thanks for that.

Just as a fill in. In passing, I see Terry Wogan has done a programme for the BBC, Ireland revisited.

After 40 years, Sir Terry Wogan returns to Ireland, stepping back into his past to explore how the country helped shape him, and looking at what it means to be Irish in the 21st century.

Four programmes scheduled to begin 24 January 2011. BBC1 9.00pm.

Should be interesting.

BTW. Watch out for the story of how white children will become a minority in Birmingham at the next census. 2011.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/patrickburns/2011/01/britains_first_white_minority.html
.

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