Posted by Diamed on Wed, 19 Nov 2008 20:32 | #

Why should people hide their BNP membership anyway?  It’s legal to belong to the party, so whatever repercussions made against you can only = name-calling, or boycotting/firing.  However, the amish do just fine providing all they need for themselves, if the people of the BNP were serious, they could get together and create their own goods and provide everything they need in life for themselves, and to hell with Britain.  Not only that, but they could make their own schools for their children, have their own community where you knew your kids would marry someone of similar genes and mindset, have true friends, neighbors, and fellow believers—-honestly ‘persecution’ would be the best thing that ever happened to them.  But that’s only if they’re serious.  So long as people want to be white nationalists at night, and respectable gentlemen by day, the world has power over them and can control their every action.  The moment we don’t need the world is the moment we become independent in all but name.  The sooner we turn to that the better.

Everyone knows suffering together and braving dangers is one of the strongest bonds known to man.  The ‘long march’ Mao underwent separated the wheat from the chaff, and afterwards the communists knew they could rely on each other and eventually won.  The same for the ‘beerhall putsch’ and streetfights nazis participated in before they came to power, you knew the character and the commitment of those people and could rely on each other.  The same for Muhammed in his early rocky start, with just a few believers and vastly outnumbered, he won at the battle of Badr, thus cementing the bond between all his men and forging the mightiest army in the world, due to their fellowship and sense of trust in each other and in God who gave them victory.  And lastly the early Christian who gathered secretly, suffering under the persecutions of the romans and suffering martyrdom one after another rather than renouncing their beliefs—and look what they gained, their community and faith only grew stronger, until eventually they conquered 1/3 of the world!  Look how the mormons were hounded about Illinois and Missouri until their epic trek across America into the wasteland of Utah gave them a new identity and community that couldn’t be broken.  Look how they all trusted the leaders who stood with the mormons of that day and imparted courage to their descendants.

No, skulking about and carrying on your daily life without any pain, any suffering, any persecution, does NOT help white nationalism.  Sacrifice, suffering, dying, being persecuted, being ethnic cleansed—Does.  Requiring people to stand up and suffer for their beliefs is the easiest way to make them serious about them, to more closely identify themselves with those beliefs and their fellow believers, to become partners in a venture that is do or die.

Mandela, Jesus, Joseph Smith, Hitler, Lenin, Solzhenitsyn, who wasn’t at some point in jail for his beliefs?  And yet eventually all of their revolutions succeeded!  It isn’t a coincidence.

Posted by Englander on Wed, 19 Nov 2008 20:44 | #

The rational for theory three works for theory two.  This seems the most likely explanation to me.

Posted by John on Wed, 19 Nov 2008 21:08 | #

Why should people hide their BNP membership anyway?  It’s legal to belong to the party, so whatever repercussions made against you can only = name-calling, or boycotting/firing.  However, the amish do just fine providing all they need for themselves, if the people of the BNP were serious, they could get together and create their own goods and provide everything they need in life for themselves, and to hell with Britain.  Not only that, but they could make their own schools for their children, have their own community where you knew your kids would marry someone of similar genes and mindset, have true friends, neighbors, and fellow believers—-honestly ‘persecution’ would be the best thing that ever happened to them.

How about a “whites only” mutual currency?

Posted by snax on Wed, 19 Nov 2008 21:41 | #

Are you Amish, diamed? If not the Amish, which community to do you belong to?

Posted by Bert Rustle on Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:11 | #

I presume that the objective is along the lines of the developing situation in France: http://galliawatch.blogspot.com/2008/11/more-dissent-among-nationalists.html

Posted by Delta Scout on Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:32 | #

I’m an American (of English descent) member of the BNP in the US and if actions against me are taken due to my membership of a legal political party, I am fully prepared to initiate legal actions against the individuals and/or organisations involved.  I expect it will reap a tidy sum. This is what we’ve been waiting for. Bring it on.

Posted by zuwr on Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:40 | #

Fractures in the far right are a pressing problem which needs to be addressed before we can overcome.  I am speaking of not just the BNP, but various Minuteman groups, California Coalition for Immigration Control, the NA, etc, etc.  These groups all split over personality issues.  My guess is that this is a failure of personality.  The principals in the groups have perceive their own contributions are better than the contributions of other group leaders.  They find fault with other members more easily than they find fault with themselves.  Sociability may not be possible if these individuals are the descendants of rugged individuals and not the descendants of ‘get along’ types.  How is the personality of the group leaders and also their dissenters different from leader of more mainstream organizations?  Are the group leaders making errors in perception?  Or is the problem mainly with the dissenters?

Posted by snax on Wed, 19 Nov 2008 22:46 | #

zuwr, the problem is our revolution is not imminent and the leader is not yet known. When the time is right and the path is known, the kind of petty squabbling you describe will end.

Posted by Diamed on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:18 | #

I’m not sure what your point is or how my being amish or not matters, but I don’t belong to any community.

Posted by snax on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 02:42 | #

Oh, then you’re not ‘serious’, Diamed?

Posted by john on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 02:51 | #

Same happened in Australia a few years back, jews, who printed the list in one of their newspapers. Who cares, just another storm in a teacup, good for the BNP. I hope the story has legs with persecutions and prosecutions etc.

Posted by snax on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 03:14 | #

John raises a fourth alternative to GW’s three. The list may have been leaked by someone intending to help the BNP, figuring that the response from “outraged” employers and unions would engender more sympathy for the party and its members than revulsion.

Posted by Diamed on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 03:45 | #

I would argue rather that I’m the only serious person on earth and therefore haven’t found anyone else serious enough to follow through with my entirely serious and entirely sensible plans.  Since a ‘community’ requires at least 3,000 people of reproductive fitness and at least half of them women to be viable, call me when you find another 2,999.

Posted by snax on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 04:03 | #

John Jay Ray was notably absent from the list. That didn’t last long…

Posted by pshaw on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 13:14 | #

I would argue rather that I’m the only serious person on earth and therefore haven’t found anyone else serious enough to follow through with my entirely serious and entirely sensible plans.  Since a ‘community’ requires at least 3,000 people of reproductive fitness and at least half of them women to be viable, call me when you find another 2,999.

Or the idea’s just come to you.  Or you’re in the preparatory stages.  Or you’ve just implemented the idea and are not fully “there,” yet.

It doesn’t matter.

Attacking this sensible idea ….

…if the people of the BNP were serious, they could get together and create their own goods and provide everything they need in life for themselves, and to hell with Britain.  Not only that, but they could make their own schools for their children, have their own community where you knew your kids would marry someone of similar genes and mindset, have true friends, neighbors, and fellow believers—-honestly ‘persecution’ would be the best thing that ever happened to them.  But that’s only if they’re serious.  So long as people want to be white nationalists at night, and respectable gentlemen by day, the world has power over them and can control their every action.  The moment we don’t need the world is the moment we become independent in all but name.  The sooner we turn to that the better.

…by “discrediting” you is what WN Internet “generals,” pensioners, government agents, and the SPLC/ADL do best.

Posted by John on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 17:22 | #

…if the people of the BNP were serious, they could get together and create their own goods and provide everything they need in life for themselves, and to hell with Britain.  Not only that, but they could make their own schools for their children, have their own community where you knew your kids would marry someone of similar genes and mindset, have true friends, neighbors, and fellow believers—-honestly ‘persecution’ would be the best thing that ever happened to them.  But that’s only if they’re serious.  So long as people want to be white nationalists at night, and respectable gentlemen by day, the world has power over them and can control their every action.  The moment we don’t need the world is the moment we become independent in all but name.  The sooner we turn to that the better.

This lady’s http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5455605137215634518&hl=en critique and suggested alternatives to the “beast” financial system look promising. Here’s her website http://solari.com/

I’d hoped there’d be more discussion about my mutual currency idea. It would dovetail quite nice with the agorist approach GW suggests.

Posted by Matra on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 17:46 | #

Why should people hide their BNP membership anyway?

Why do post under a pseudonym if you feel that way? Indeed, let’s have your address, and the name of the school your children attend.

Posted by Englander on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 17:55 | #

GW, I haven’t had time to browse the comments sections of the MSN articles on this story, and I was wondering if you had and if there was anything interesting to report. Is the general tone sympathetic to the BNP members or not?

Posted by Matra on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 18:50 | #

There’s a vile article in the Guardian right here by someone called Nicholas Blincoe:

But I still do not understand the stupidity. Why do members of the British National party see themselves as patriots,

when the whole of the British identity is based around resisting the onslaught of racists?

The Bulldog Breed, the Few, the Dunkirk Spirit, V for Victory, Bluebirds and Spitfires – which part of the second world war do the BNP not understand?

I want to stage displays of disapproval to the members of the BNP in my neighbourhood. Not a witch-hunt, just something quiet, well-mannered and, I suppose, a bit British. Cutting them dead in the greengrocers, for instance.

The comment section beneath is more interesting - though I only read those on page 4 where they are overwhelmingly hostile to the author of the piece.

Posted by Matra on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 18:54 | #

I meant to put the quotation ‘when the whole of the British identity is based around resisting the onslaught of racists?’ in bold.

Posted by Diamed on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 19:20 | #

I’m an American, America has no BNP, no one would wish to join me in said community, and thus I can gain nothing from losing my anonymity.  Furthermore, anonymity helps people engage the idea and not the personality of their opponents and debate partners, which I greatly prefer.  Ideas stand on their own merits, regardless of who stated them, their truth or falsehood is a separate issue.  The sooner people on this forum act like this, the better the conversation will be, and the higher the intellectual level and content our comments will have, the less we engage and snipe at each other’s personality or character flaws, and the more we focus on each other’s ideas and THEIR qualities or flaws.  Call it an idle hope.

Posted by Rusty Mason on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 20:44 | #

Perhaps a separatist could find some kindred spirits here:
http://www.secessionist.us/

Posted by Rusty Mason on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 21:05 | #

Separation without fear:

* Cancel all hostile magazines and newspapers.
* Cancel your cable TV subscription. 
* Have only one television.

* Homeschool, teach homeschool classes.
* Become a leader or at least a strong member of a historical or cultural society in your area.
* Tend a year-round garden.

You can do these right now.  The first three save mind and money, and they directly weaken the power of the enemy.  The second three cost time and money, but are highly effective change agents at the local level.  As a leader, you will draw in those friendly to your point of view, and you will be able to cleanse your children of the mental and physical toxins they are consuming now.

Valete

Posted by Rusty Mason on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 21:29 | #

Another brilliant idea (thank you, thank you all) is to teach your kids to camp, shoot, fish, and hunt.  You’ll all gain valuable skills and experience, will be closer as a family unit, and can give help to others who want to do the same. 

Change will not be found at the ballot box, the rot is too deep.

Posted by joe on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 23:38 | #

I am active in the BNP though not a member because my views are more towards the National Front. Unfortunately my name is not on the list, but I wish it was because I would be proud to be on it. I have been in touch with my leafleting team and we are resolved to double our output from 500 each a week each to 1000. Our heads will be high and we will proudly bring our message of hope to our oppressed people in the same way as our forefathers charged machine guns with their bayonets fixed.
It is all very well sitting behind computers with fancy ideas about setting up communities, but the war is happening now and there is no point sitting on the fence. Think of those nationalists under pressure and do something about it. I assure you there is nothing more satisfying than to deliver leaflets, (we get a hell of a lot more positive responses than negative ones) as it is sticking it up the enemy. If you haven’t the stomach to go out leafleting yourself then please make a donation to the BNP as although we chip in everything we can afford, we can only use cheap paper where we would rather be delivering glossy ones.
Remember, this is the last chance for our people, let’s turn this setback into a glorious victory, against the enemies of free speech, freedom and democracy. Get in touch with your local branch now, either donate something or join us on the front line.

Posted by Guessedworker on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 23:50 | #

Englander,

As Matra has indicated, one of the two interesting things is the hostility of a substantial part, and possibly a majority, of the MSM commentariat to the articles on this.  Of course, I am speaking only for the qualities.  I haven’t trawled through the redtops.  Go to the CiF articles below and have a look at who scores the heaviest on “recommended” clicks.

The other interesting thing is the type of hack who has written a piece on the issue.

At The Times we get the Jew David Aaronovitch:-

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/david_aaronovitch/article5191772.ece

and the Jew Hugo Rifkind:-

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/hugo_rifkind/article5201307.ece

At the Guardian we get the black woman Lola Adesioye:-

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/nov/19/bnp-members-list?commentpage=1

And the rather obviously limp-going-on-homosexual white, Nicholas Blincoe:-

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/nov/20/nicholas-blincoe-bnp-list?commentpage=1

I don’t think the Telegraph or the Independent has managed an article at all thus far.

Posted by Fred Scrooby on Thu, 20 Nov 2008 23:54 | #

God bless you, Joe!

Posted by Guessedworker on Fri, 21 Nov 2008 00:04 | #

Joe,

Don’t underestimate what effect folks like us can have.  We are talking to the intelligent and articulate in, I hope, a language that is more truthful and intellectually satisfying than the flag-waving, anti-Islamist nonsense that you guys have to communicate.  Our readers go out into the world and speak their truth, and the people they reach do likewise.  It’s like a pyramid scheme.  There is a place for it.

I hope this event does confound the leaker, whoever it was, and provides the party with a boost.  It is, after all, all we’ve got.  Supposedly, it was P.T.Barnum who first said “All publicity is good publicity.”  True of all circuses, I think.

Posted by joe on Fri, 21 Nov 2008 00:33 | #

Guessedworker

Nobody admires you more than me. I regularly read your site and have backed your comments in the telegraph.
But please:
” We are talking to the intelligent and articulate in, I hope, a language that is more truthful and intellectually satisfying than the flag-waving, anti-Islamist nonsense that you guys have to communicate.”
We are the people who give their weekend mornings (starting next week evenings as well) delivering leflets in areas you would not go to. We are the ones who deliver votes by meeting the people and showing them we are not the stereotype that the media portray us as. We are also the ones that every two thousand leaflets have to deal with an outraged lefty.
I think I am on the wrong site.

Posted by Guessedworker on Fri, 21 Nov 2008 01:12 | #

No, you’re not.  I’m asking you to accomodate us.  Not the other way around.

Posted by Guessedworker on Fri, 21 Nov 2008 01:22 | #

I would just add that the real function of a site like this is not to awaken people but to explore the world we are in, and just perhaps clear a few paths out of it.

In my file on the Frankfurt School I’ve got a quote by one of the Jewish genetlemen who ran it: “It has been our intention from the outset to maintain uniformity in the way we look at problems and go about solving them.”

That’s a good enough formulation for me.  We are a disparate crew and we badly need to develop more unified thoughtways.

Posted by Bill on Fri, 21 Nov 2008 09:13 | #

It’s difficult to get a handle on the MSM’s reaction and treatment of the BNP now days.  Something seems to have changed.  OK, sure they are as hysterical as ever but even so, I detect the cock sureness has gone out of their thinking, they they have lost the confidence to press home their attacks.  Why is this?

IMO, what is obvious to everyone - is now becoming obvious to the MSM, the increasing national support for the BNP, coupled with a realised bias against the MSM, is sinking in at the heart of the establishment.  They (MSM) certainly are different to us, they really do not understand that people like Joe are not ashamed of their country, their heritage, their culture, their history and their membership of its only champion (the BNP) - on the contarary, they are damn proud to do so.

I’ve always said the biggest recruiter for the BNP is the MSM.  It didn’t seem to occur to the MSM that the reason for members reluctance to be outed was that the felt intimidated and hassled by a fascist regime.  Who is calling who a fascist in all of this?

The tug of war of confusion (John Sargent & Strictly) with the MSM is confusing the people of this country, even so, the balance is shifting as more and more people realise the establishment is selling them out to the third world.  The MSM are rapidly reaching the point (as I predicted) where they realise that to be seen as anti BNP is to to be seen as anti British, and are seen by the populace at large as waging war against their own people.

This was to become inevitable - not exactly rocket science is it?

As time goes on, the MSM will have to up the anti, and in doing so will engender more resistance.  How long before the MSM denounce the BNP as a terrorist organisation and their members become insurgents?

Will the Battle of Britain will be won or lost over the airwaves of the MSM or Internet?  Perhaps the Joe’s of this world would contest this, but of course it will be won by everyone getting involved in some form or another - in a myriad of different ways

Joe, I admire what you and your fellow members are doing, you are at the sharp end, and that takes guts - I take my hat off to you Sir.

Joe, please post more, tell us pc jockeys what it’s really like out there - I for one, would appreciate that.

Keep Safe.

Posted by Guessedworker on Fri, 21 Nov 2008 11:07 | #

Further to my post at at 10.50pm last night, listing the quality MSM commentary thusfar, today’s Guardian carries another offering, this time by a black woman with the interesting name of Afua Hirsch:-

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/nov/20/bnp-far-right-law

Posted by Fred Scrooby on Fri, 21 Nov 2008 15:25 | #

“Joe, I admire what you and your fellow members are doing, you are at the sharp end, and that takes guts - I take my hat off to you Sir.”  (—Bill)

I second that from this side of the Atlantic.  Joe’s comments made me feel a lot better.

Posted by ken on Fri, 21 Nov 2008 16:18 | #

“..more and more people realise the establishment is selling them out to the third world. The MSM are rapidly reaching the point (as I predicted) where they realise that to be seen as anti BNP is to be seen as anti British, and are seen by the populace at large as waging war on their own people.” Sounds like the paradigm shift we’ve long awaited! Nice analysis Bill.

Posted by Bill on Sat, 22 Nov 2008 09:28 | #

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2008/nov/22/bnp-far-right-hazel-blears

Rise of BNP is politicians’ fault - Blears - Guardian

The above is a front page feature article in the UK’s Guardian

I skimmed through,  looking to see what it (article) was saying about immigration, only to find that immigration had absolute nothing to do with the rise of he BNP - Surprise! Surprise!

I may have missed something in my haste, but can you spot the dreaded ‘I’ word?

How thankful we should be for this blind spot these people have - it could be our savior.

Posted by a Finn on Sat, 22 Nov 2008 13:45 | #

Guessedworker, are you sure you know everything relevant concerning Jonathan Bowden case? Is it e.g. true that there have been another Jonathan Bowden, child molester, who was mixed up with BNP’s Jonathan Bowden? Do you trust Antifa sites you link, whose writers believe that reality is almost totally socially constructed, thus giving them ideological licence to lie?

Anyway. like many large groups BNP has good and bad sides. As far as I know the good sides heavily outweigh the bad ones. The way to reduce the bad things is to participate and influence.

The best and most far reaching decision BNP has made is to officially oppose mixed marriages. If they can realize it in practice, they have started endogamy and the essential ingredient of separate group evolution.

Posted by a Finn on Sat, 22 Nov 2008 15:06 | #

Nick Griffin sets the record straight for BNP:

http://www.wvwnews.net/story.php?id=6084

Posted by Lurker on Sat, 22 Nov 2008 16:06 | #

Bill - you should know by now there are no ‘root causes’ behind BNP support. There are, of course, root causes behind Muslim suicide bombers, Somali pirates etc etc But white people voting BNP, never. They are simply evil or psychologically disturbed not rational.

Posted by Guessedworker on Sat, 22 Nov 2008 18:17 | #

Finn,

We have a child abuse register in the UK, and had “our” Jonathan Bowden been on it, the fact would have been uncovered with great glee by the antifas.  So, yes, I think they are to be trusted.  But if you want to go to the Covert Tactics website and assess the kind of man who “broke the story” originally, it’s here:-

http://www.covert-tactics.blogspot.com/

Posted by Captainchaos on Sat, 22 Nov 2008 19:24 | #

Covert Undercover Nuisance Tactics or C.U.N.T.  Well, I never.  Not terribly family friendly, but I’ve got to hand it to them, I haven’t laughed so hard in ages.

Posted by a Finn on Sat, 22 Nov 2008 22:41 | #

Having now seen that Covert tactics blog, allegations of it’is connections to Nick Griffin seem suspicious. What evidence there are to support it? To my knowledge, that kind of blogs /persons are exactly the kind that Griffin distances himself from. We have those kind of persons in Finland too, and they are not in anybody’s control, often not even themselves.

Posted by Glyn Roach on Mon, 24 Nov 2008 13:27 | #

One particulary harrasing sender to people on the list calls itself Jethro Tull. 
and try tofrighten.  Could any computer experts here retaliate as an excercise in counter terrorism?

http://www.bnplist.co.uk/

The address they hide behind is - .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address)

Hundreds of names and addies were in the public domain anyway from activities like organising and standing for councils.

Posted by Glyn Roach on Mon, 24 Nov 2008 14:06 | #

You will have heard about Liverpool police arresting 13 BNP leafletters last Saturday and torturing one?  This is how they did it so they could take his fingerprints etc.

“They then somehow applied a tremendous pressure behind my ears, inflicting great pain,” he continued. Photographs taken shortly afterwards clearly showed bleeding from wounds sustained behind both Mr Tierney’s ears.

applied some kind of pressure to his arms and his side, once again leaving considerable bruising, evidenced again by photographs taken shortly after his release. the g

“They then pulled my head back so far that my windpipe was restricted, and while I was gasping for air, applied pressure to the front of my neck as well,” he said. Nearly collapsing from the pain and lack of oxygen, Mr Tierney was then unable to prevent the policemen from taking his fingerprints.

“Next they grabbed hold of my nose, and once again somehow applied the most penetrating pressure to the back of my neck, forcing my mouth open to take a DNA swab,” he continued. The whole episode lasted at least a quarter of an hour, and Mr Tierney was left shaken and in pain,

The above experience sounds remarkably like the torture mentioned here in an article about claims of torture at Guantanamo Bay.

“The MPs [military police] inflicted so much pain, Mr Aamer said he thought he was going to die. The MPs pressed on pressure points all over his body: his temples, just under his jawline, in the hollow beneath his ears. They choked him. They bent his nose so hard he thought it would break.”

Posted by John on Mon, 24 Nov 2008 18:50 | #

However, the amish do just fine providing all they need for themselves, if the people of the BNP were serious, they could get together and create their own goods and provide everything they need in life for themselves, and to hell with Britain.  Not only that, but they could make their own schools for their children, have their own community where you knew your kids would marry someone of similar genes and mindset, have true friends, neighbors, and fellow believers—-honestly ‘persecution’ would be the best thing that ever happened to them.

Their own currency and banks would greatly facilitate such measures. The Lakotas in the US are doing it: http://press.freelakotabank.com/

Posted by Humphry Gittins on Thu, 27 Nov 2008 10:52 | #

Lee Barnes was on on Radio 4’s Moral Maze last night and quite brilliantly put Melannie the Fraud in the picture but lost it after probably lack of experience combined with knowing these old- hands were all against him. Portillo was fair to him though.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00fl5w5/Moral_Maze_26112008

Posted by Bill on Thu, 27 Nov 2008 14:31 | #

Thanks Humph.

If ever the liberal multi culti debate becomes inclusive and invites the BNP into the discussion then the liberals will be sunk without trace.

If anything was amply demonstrated in this Lee Barnes discussion was that the liberal starting position is false and illegitimate.

The liberal argument begins with an illegitimate fait accompli, a stated given that has never been put to the test in open debate by the people.  The people of this country have never been invited to set the parameters of the immigration debate, in fact the opposite is the case, they have been browbeaten, they have been marginalized, legislated against, decried as racist bigots, Hitler’s you name it, they, the people have been shut out of any discourse on the multicultural question in Britain.  The rules of the game have been set in stone by the political elites.

So, the likes of BNP’s Lee Barnes are thrown into the amphitheatre of a rigged debate where the parameters have been set long ago - without any public input whatsoever.  The liberal gladiators already armed to the teeth descend upon their defenceless victim with their claims of racism, political correctness, intolerance and discrimination, reducing the status of their opponent to a non human - how very brave of them.

So what doe Lee Barnes do?  He tears into them at 90mph flattening all opposition and do you know what?  I think it paid off.  His belligerent offensive found a chink in the liberal armour, he steamrollered their arrogant claims and assertions, he got his message across and in a liberal audience this is nigh impossible, any neutral observer would have been asking themselves, who are the fascists in all of this?

Onwards and upwards.

Posted by Fred Scrooby on Thu, 27 Nov 2008 17:26 | #

”If ever the liberal multi culti debate becomes inclusive and invites the BNP into the discussion then the liberals will be sunk without trace.”  (—Bill)

Exactly, Bill, and that’s why they never permit open debate:  in open debate they face certain defeat and know it, and no sign is more certain of your position’s untruth than that:  if you can’t win in free and open debate you are backing a lie.  Their only hope is to suppress, stifle, squelch, muzzle, demonize, lie, cheat, not play by the rules, kick the other guy in the groin, stomp with your boot on his face over, and over, and over again.  Forever.  No there’s nothing new about it; t’s all there in Orwell’s book, all patiently explained to Winston Smith — one has only to go read it. 

We who ask only to be allowed to speak are demonized, slandered, muzzled, threatened, punished, fired from our jobs, arrested, fined, imprisoned, ruined, and for what?  For asking to speak.  That’s all. 

That’s our only crime.  We want to suppress no one, we want to punish no one, we want to kick no one in the groin as we are being kicked in the groin non-stop.  We humbly, politely, respectfully ask permission only to open our mouths and to speak.  And the answer always comes back with brutal finality and the most seething, vicious, clenched-jawed hatred:  Permission to speak is denied sub-human scum the likes of you lot. 

That’s how they hope to win:  “Rules?  What rules?  There are no rules.  Civilized debate?  Fair play?  Justice?  Democracy, what’s that???  We only understand winning.  Winning at all costs.  You saw us in action when we were last on the scene running the show as Bolsheviks, right?  Right you saw that, well that’s exactly how we intend to play the game in our current guise as multiculturalist multiracialist race-and-nation deniers and destroyers.  No difference.  So get with the program and learn to love it because we’re in charge now.  Bolshevism didn’t get us what we were after, so we’re going to go about it this way.”

”If anything was amply demonstrated in this Lee Barnes discussion it was that the liberal starting position is false and illegitimate.

“The liberal argument begins with an illegitimate fait accompli, a stated given that has never been put to the test in open debate by the people.  The people of this country have never been invited to set the parameters of the immigration debate; in fact the opposite is the case:  they have been browbeaten, they have been marginalized, legislated against, decried as “racist bigots,” “Hitlers,” you name it, they, the people, have been shut out of any discourse on the multicultural question in Britain.  The rules of the game have been set in stone by the political elites.

“So, the likes of BNP’s Lee Barnes are thrown into the amphitheatre of a rigged debate where the parameters have been set long ago - without any public input whatsoever.  The liberal gladiators already armed to the teeth descend upon their defenceless victim with their claims of racism, political correctness, intolerance and discrimination, reducing the status of their opponent to a non human - how very brave of them.”

Exceedingly well put there by Bill:  that’s exactly how the game is played by the other side.  But it can’t last, and their days in power are numbered, because ... well ... the other thing that won’t last is our slumbers.

Posted by Armor on Thu, 27 Nov 2008 18:29 | #

The liberal argument begins with an illegitimate fait accompli (—Bill)

and the first illegitimate fait accompli is the control of the media by race-replacement ideologues. They will argue, for example, that it is not right to deny school access to the children of illegal immigrants. But for some reason, we are not allowed to ask who brought illegal immigrants here in the first place, and why they are not expelled. The questions open to debate will be: how can we improve the lives of children’s immigrants, how can we open white people’s minds, etc.
I especially hate the BBC program “Any questions”, where the public is made to ask “the right questions”, as if the questions did not come from the BBC frauds. The objective is to make radio listeners feel isolated, as if normal people agreed with the genocidal left.
If invited, a BNP member would say that the debates are framed in the wrong way. He would contest the pretense that the journalists are doing acceptable, honest work, and the idea that non-whites cannot be expelled.

Posted by Bill on Fri, 28 Nov 2008 22:52 | #

I can’t say I have had many conversations with a liberal; the sum total of my views on Marxist Liberalism have been acquired mainly through the media of television (and of course - the Internet.)

In many ways, Marxist Liberalism is akin to religion where comes a point in their thinking where belief in reality must be suspended.  It is at this point they enter the rarefied atmosphere where ‘anything is possible’.

Perhaps the most improbable aspect of their thinking is their blind spot disconnect between the consequences of engineered human behaviour and the natural consequences of natural behaviour.  Post-modern liberalism produces an inverted world and of course it will never work - are they deterred?  No way! All that is needed is a little engineering, a tweak here - a tweak there. 

In my view, most liberals are simply useful idiots. (People who unwittingly and enthusiastically support a course of action/ideas that ultimately will cause their downfall)  The hard core Marxists simply employ liberalism as a vehicle for destruction.

The architects of race replacement have cleverly, nay, pod like, (Invasion of the Body Snatchers) hoodwinked the support of millions of these useful idiots mainly through media and academia - with stupendous success.

The hypnotic brainwashing by the elite’s useful idiots on the stupid public mainly takes place through the medium of television, it is here the public’s trancelike acceptance of the liberate World View takes hold. They blindly learn and parrot the Ten Commandments of liberalism just as easily as all of the rest of the trivial pap.

It cannot be overstated the role and influence that television wields in this cultural war, I have oft repeated that without television this war could not be sustained.

Have you noticed a further crumbling at the soft edge of liberalism?  There’s always has been a soft useful idiot edge, you know the type …”I’m not a racist but”…well his mates have joined him but the message is slightly different…” I agree, I do find the BNP’s views odious, but I don’t think they should be”….”

Of course, as the noose tightens, many more useful idiots will vote with their mouthing of such like. 

What does all this add up to?  This post-modern Marxist Liberal ideology, expressed in terms of political correctness, tolerance and non-discrimination is nought but a strategy to force us into a compliant psychological straightjacket.  Political correctness is the stick with which to beat us over the head should we digress.

In other words, the guilt ridden types do not themselves subscribe to these ideas as it is just a means to assuage their own guilt by committing our, (West’s) suicide.

Post-modern Liberal Marxism has never been held to public scrutiny, and the political class will do everything in their power to keep it that way.  Perhaps the most intriguing question of the moment is, when and how will the dam burst?

Afterthought

I often wonder - if the elites manage to pull off this fantastic coup and whites are no longer, which group will succeed them in the oppressor stakes?  For it seems to me that Marxist Liberalism will forever require necessitating victim and oppressor groups for renewal.  It seems logical that what we are now experiencing is a self-replicating cycle which in the end - leaves a world without humans.  Hmmm?